Some Ways to Make Analyzing of Charts Simpler

[Khoo Hock Leong]

Yes, what I meant is that the Saturn you mentioned would not get Mars 7th aspect.

Rashi aspect is under Jaimini. Retrogade is a concept under Parasara class of astrology which place more emphasis on planets even if Jaimini talk about planets too. So no, there is no Rashi aspect from the previous position as far as Jaimini is concerned. But we can always use 2 different schools of thought together. Like Jaimini consider empty houses aspecting empty houses too. And because we are considering two classes of astrology together, this would mean a retrogade planet would cast a Rashi aspect from its previous position too.

It goes to show by combining many views together, we will always arrive at the correct and best answer.

[hiimnotcool]

Khoo,

I just read your last post. If such is the case then my chart is VERY good. Can you take a quick look and use the simple analyzing techniques to see? No thrills or shills. I also do not a reading...I would just like to know if you think my chart is positive or negative overall.

Aug, 29, 1985
22:33 (10:33 PM)
Sacramento, California

[Khoo Hock Leong]

I try not to unless it is very much part of a discussion like a point in astrology I am trying to find out.

[hiimnotcool]

okay. i really do feel like my chart exemplifies a lot of your points in this thread though. i understand regardless because i know you are quite busy. thank you.

[GNE]

Thanks for the reply again Khoo,

I had another thought/question: What about the effects of a planet in a retrograde planet's nakshatra?
Since retrograde makes the planet more powerful, could we say then that the nakshatra lord is very powerful?
Would we look at the nakshatra dispositor as being placed in the previous house but effects of the one it's natally placed?

ex: a planet in Anuradha and then Saturn is retrograde...

thanks


edit: and any final opinion on retrograde malefics?
I find this chart to be interesting, since the person had the rise of their lives + became ultra rich and famous during the dasha of retrograde saturn in enemy sign cancer, in it's own nakshatra Saturn isn't in many 'good' yogas, and is infact part of a pap kartari yoga on ascendant...
18 December 1946
18:16
Cincinnati, Ohio, 39n10, 84w27

This is the chart of film director/producer Steven Spielberg.

I find it interest too if using the belief that a retrograde planet acts like it's vedhak, saturn then becomes like mars, which then is in it's debilitation sign cancer, also an enemy to the ascendant (mercury).
why such a large rise? Could it be that retrograde malefic acted benefic?

[Khoo Hock Leong]

Another way to make analyzing of charts simpler is to concentrate on sandhi only. No meed to care about gadanta.

Sandhi cases cover gadanta cases in case newer readers are not familiar. Analyzing through the sandhi lens is good enough because one factor in planets' strengths is their avasthas and thst is determined by how close a planet is to the beginning and end of a sign. Nakshatras ending (or for that matter beginning) are seldom considered.

[Khoo Hock Leong]

Note that Yogas are everything. They should be given first priority in analysing the chart, save for the lagna and lagna lord. Note also the quality of the yogas must be guaged. Example the Lakshmi Yoga as defined by Phaladeepika involving Venus and the 9th lord is not so strong for an Aquarius Lagna because Venus is at the same time the 9th lord meaning only Venus is involved - the good energy carried is less.

An example on giving yogas first priority would be we know from the Tony Blair article by Mr Vaughn Paul that Venus-Saturn or Saturn-Venus dasa is bad or one must be cautious about it espcially if both planets have strength like exaltation, vargottam, yogakaraka etc.

But look at Bill Gate's chart. He has Venus and Saturn both very well placed. I am not sure whether he has gone through a combination of Venus and Saturn dasa but these two planets are direct participants of the said Lakshmi Yoga so he is unlikely to suffer a downfall.

[GNE]

Bill gates did go through venus-saturn at some point around 1994 or so (I didn't check exact date...)

but I noticed Steven Spielberg also went through Saturn-Venus, around 1982- , which was a great time for him...
just completed/released ET which was ultra successful, aswell as the first indiana jones movie was out just before, fame rose and money from those poured in, he also produced a few hit horror movies like poltergiest during that bhukti..

So whats the principle to see if Saturn-Venus will be good?
in my reading with Vaughn Paul a year ago he told me Saturn-Mer + Sat-Venus, "especially venus" will be one of my best. But I didn't ask why as at the time it seemed obvious, and I wasn't aware of the BPHS principle about how it's often a very difficult time.

Do we see where Venus is placed from Saturn?
as then Bill gates has it 1/1 obviously, and Spielberg has his venus 4th from saturn/saturn in 10th from venus...
Mine are then 5/9 from each other.

Or do we just see strength / placement of sat/venus?
But then I must ask again about Spielbergs saturn...which doesn't seem too fantastic considering the great heights it brought him too. But it is retrograde.... which is the key, I feel...


I check BPHS and it says:
" Effects, like marriage, birth of a son, gain of wealth, sound health, well-being in the
family, acquisition of a kingdom, enjoyments by the beneficence of the king, honours, gain of
clothes, ornaments, conveyance and other desired objects, will be derived in the Antar Dasha
of Śukr in the Dasha of Śani, if Śukr is in a Kendr, Trikon, or in Labh, associated with, or
receiving a Drishti from benefics. If during the period of Antar Dasha of Śukr Guru is
favourable in transit, there will be dawn of fortune and growth of property. If Śani is
favourable in transit, there will be Raj Yog effects, or the accomplishment of Yog rites (Yog
Triya Siddhi). "

so maybe because Venus was in kendra/trine from Saturn it wasn't very negative. ?
Venus gets associated with benefics in Speilbergs chart, and mine (if we count mercury as benefic...it is lag lord afterall+friend to venus) maybe this is why Vaughn Paul said to look forward to it..

[Khoo Hock Leong]

See whether Venus and Saturn are direct participants in a Yoga in Steven Spielberg and your chart. Either that OR are they not vargottam, not own or exalted or even friendly sign or yogakarakas.......that was the condition for a bad Venus cum Saturn period.

Therefore to reinstate for a bad Venus cum Saturn period 2 conditions must be satisfied :

(1) They are not direct participants of a major beneficial yoga. Like dhana or raja or a good nahabsa (spelling? - these are yogas involving distribution of planets in a chart) etc.

(2) They are not well placed by sign or have just moderate strength in the number of divisional charts etc. The placement MUST NOT BE TOO POOR because that would also lead to a poor period as obvious like if both planets are neecha that would give a bad period too. The factors involved are placement factors and not association and aspects factors, say, going by the definition of the yoga for a bad period of Venus cum Saturn to take place.

[GNE]

Venus is exalted/retrograde+in 10th for myself, with mercury (also retrograde).
Speilbergs is in libra in 5th with jupiter and moon.

no related to saturn for either of us,
except I do have venus/mercury in saturn's nakshatra.

both of us have saturn in 10th from moon, in enemy sign (moon for him + scorpio for me) and both have saturn also retrograde.

I noticed Ben Affleck, another who went through Saturn-Venus dasha during a great time in his life (marriage, directed his first breakout movie that got good reviews + started getting cast in the best reviewed films of his recent career + more money,etc.)

He has Gemini lagna too ,
saturn in 12th in taurus,
venus in lagna

No one (speilberg/affleck / myself) have either vargottama.

We all have Venus in Gopuramsa division. (of course this changes if the amsa bala calculation on jhora gets tweaked...it actually only goes up...either to 5-simhasana or 7-devaloka for me/speilberg if ayanamsa is tweaked)


what do you think?
even though the planets are in no yoga together, but at least 1 (venus especially) is well placed ...
not to mention saturn retrograde for myself / speilberg (which we spoke of in a previous thread)..

Ben Afflecks is a little confusing since ven/sat are 2/12 from one another, and saturn is in 12th and aspected by rahu from 8th. (saturn in mars nakshatra, venus in rahu nakshatra)

[Khoo Hock Leong]

I am replying to your earlier question.

Nakshatra aspects is a field of study by itself, they have different aspects from Parasara sign aspects. So if if you talk about whether a retrogade planet has influence on its previous nakshatra, I believe you have to use the Sarvatobhadra (spelling?) chart and try seeing whether aspecting from the previous Nakshatra works etc. which you have to read up youself - by the way this has nothing to do with the Nakshatra ruler as far as retrogading is concerned (we did not talk about sign dispositor for retrogading either). We do not mix signs and nakshatras for consideration of aspects.

But we do know that a retrogade planet is strong in the nakshatra in which it is placed and therfore areas covered by that nakshatra would have a prominent part in a native's life. Say Saturn is retrogade in Pushya. The person would be highly spiritual. It would also mean nakshatra aspects would be strong from the nakshatra where the planet is placed (additional aspects from its rear looking characteristic have to use Sarvatobhadra and see whether aspecting from the previous nakshatra works as mentioned previously).

So Allison's epithet for considering retrogade planets strong works when we consider nakshatras too. Then if that nakshatra is favourably posited from the Janma (moon) nakshatra, the beneficial effects would multiply.

Example my Saturn is retrogade in Sharvana. It is the 9th Nakshatra from the Mars ruled nakshatra (best friend - this way of counting the nakshatra there is a term for it : tara?) and 27th Nakshatra from the Moon (coronation). Saturn retrogade is basically spiritual. So I made great progress in spiritual (astrological) studies especially Saturn is also in Shravana.

[Khoo Hock Leong]

Saturn also rules my 8th house.

Notice for retrogading, Allison concentrates on placement, aspect and functional rulership only, as being considerably stronger. Nothing about aspecting from previous sign, distinguising between natural benefics and natural malefics etc. But it should cover Nakshatras for placement as well and aspects (if you know what are the Nakshatra aspects cast by a planet from its position).

[Khoo Hock Leong]

I think in Tony Blair's case Venus was the Lagna Lord and Saturn is a Yogakaraka. That tips the scale.

Plus Venus and Saturn are not in any MAJOR yoga (things like dispositorshp etc. do not count, not that I am saying there is a dispositorship link between his Venus and Saturn, I am just citing an example what I meant by a major yoga).

[GNE]

Great bit of info, thank you. I will certainly do some research on the Sarvatobhadra chart, and see about it in Jhora or my friends Parashara's light software.

I was interested as like I said, my retro Mer/Ven are in the nakshatra of a retrograde Saturn (uttara bhadrapada)
Saturn is in Vishaka, (or anuradha in KP ayanamsa...).

when you mention your saturn retrograde in Shravana giving great progress in spiritual (astrological) studies, was this especially during a Saturn dasha period? (or have you not had it? I didn't look at your chart) or is it just giving it's effects all throughout life ?
(wondering as then I'll try to apply the same idea with my saturn's nakshatra placement from janma)

And as for the Saturn-Venus period thing, I assume mine seems okay... (not sure if "great" or just "okay", but I'd sort of rather not know...as long as it's not looking horrible. I'll wait and see how life goes during the time. 3 years from now...)

Thanks again

[Khoo Hock Leong]

It was during Saturn dasa Venus bhukti that I first started learning astrology.

Venus was in Pushya, a Saturn ruled Nakshatra.

[Khoo Hock Leong]

If you count the nakshatra from the Sun (another system of counting), Pushya is also the place denoting coronation.

[GNE]

Ah, interesting.
So I assume your saturn-Venus period was not very negative either.

I checked Tony Blairs chart too, and noticed his venus is exalted in 11, saturn in 5th, in a 9-10-1 raj yoga too.

[Khoo Hock Leong]

No it was not. I received a lot of job offers. My Venus is in enemy sign afflicted by Rahu but Saturn with Ketu dispositing it, it was like an inexorable unseen force pulling me towards astrology : a tapasyi yoga.

Tony Blair's yoga is like a Parashiri Yoga but with no special name unlike Bill Gate's Lakshmi yoga or my yoga (plus my Venus is somewhat afflicted). So that is the difference. Not a special yoga with a name assigned to it specially mentioned in the classic. Plus Venus as Lagana Lord and Saturn as Yogakara tips the scale against his favour as I have already mentioned.

[GNE]

makes sense , and I was unaware your venus was somewhat afflicted in that way.

And does the special named yoga need to involve both venus+saturn, like BIll Gates' did? Or what if Venus alone is in a named yoga or two? (example: if for Virgo rising if venus was forming a lakshmi yoga with mercury, but no relation to saturn)

I feel possibly Speilbergs venus was forming yogas / (least for sure it is associated with yogas in his chart, like a strong Geja-kesari) , but Saturn isn't involved.

[Khoo Hock Leong]

It should involve both Venus and Saturn since the idea is that if both are involved in a specially named yoga documented by the clsssics, the ancient sages have determined the planets concerned (in this case we are limiting ourselves to Venus and Saturn and some other planets if any) will give results of that yoga overriding any other dicta that may be said about any relationships between Venus and Saturn that does not amount to a Yoga in other parts of the classic.

[jelly29]

Very interesting ..though i cant analyse like you guys do i xan however read into the characteristics brought by planets into my own self ..saturn retrograde in swati nakshatra n in 10 th house being my ascendant Lord also rules my most habits...i cant say whether it has delayed things for me or not but thn yes it has given me a strong sense of right or wrong n most of the times i find it difficult to adjust myself knowing that it might not go in my favor..moon being in pushya nakshatra has added to that
30/6/84
20:25
Dibrugarh
Female