Planetary War

For discussion on aspects, retrograde, combustion, planetary war, vargottama, kuja dosha, alternate lagnas etc.
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Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 28 Jun 2012

Dear All,

Here many astrologers wrap up their conclusions with the concept of "planetary war" :)

Below are Vaughn Ji's views on it.

Conflicting Views on Planetary War
April 4, 2006
Vedic Astrology Diary Archives

By Vaughn Paul Manley, M.A.

When one of the five planets Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, or Saturn are within 1 degree of one another then they are said to be in a planetary war, or graha yuddha. The Sun, Moon, and the nodes of the Moon, Rahu and Ketu are excluded. These basic points are generally agreed upon by astrologers. However, there is not any uniform agreement about what the factors are that determine which planet wins the war, or about the effects on the planet who wins or loses.

Some will say that the planet with lower degrees or longitude wins the war. This is most commonly followed rule in my experience. Others will say that it's the planet of higher degrees. Other texts will stress that it's not about longitudinal degrees but latitude north or south of the ecliptic. The planet that is northerly will win the war. More confusing yet, others speculate that this refers to northerly declination not latitude. Declination is the distance a planet travels from the celestial equator. For instance, the Sun will be at its highest point of declination, about 23 degrees on the summer solstice. However, the Sun is always at 0 degrees latitude. Declination and latitude become difficult to determine because some ephemeris's and software programs will not give the latitude or declination, only longitude. There are also classical references supporting the planet that's the brightest visibly as winning the war. In this case, Venus always wins the war since it's the brightest planet.

The effects of planetary war is still another issue. Some will say that both planets suffer just like both countries suffer in a war. Others say that the victor takes over the significations of the loser just like the winning country will hoard the losing country's resources.

Sometimes translations of classic texts will also make the issue confusing. Take, for instance, the following two translations of the same verse from the Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra about planetary war:

"There is a planetary war if Mars, Mercury, Jupiter, Venus, and Saturn are together (within one degree of each other), Venus is the conqueror whether he is in North or South, but amongst the other four only one, who is in the North is the conqueror and that in the South is considered defeated in the planetary war."
- Ch. 81 v. 9.

"Should there be planetary war between Mars etc. planet and if Venus happens to be in the North or in the South, it becomes victorious. The conjunction of the other planets within one degree causes planetary war and the planet only in the north - i.e. having higher celestial longitude is reckoned as stronger and becomes victorious." - Ch. 81 v. 9.

The second translation equates higher longitude with higher latitude. I'm not convinced that this is a proper translation. In the Phaladeepika, it supports the idea of latitude not longitude:

"Planets posited in the north, possessing brilliant rays, should be considered as victorious in planetary war." - Ch. 4 v.2

Hart DeFouw's book, Light On Life, also supports this concept:

"Whichever planet has the higher latitude is declared the winner and is strengthened thereby, while the loser is weakened. Many modern books on Jyotish, however, take the planet with the lower longitude to be the victor. A planet's latitude can be found in tabulated form in a Panchanga (an Indian Ephemeris), but this is usually missing from a Western ephemeris." p. 65

Conclusion:
As you can see planetary war is a controversial and confusing issue. I am still undecided about it personally. For a long time I've used the general rule that the planet with the lowest degrees wins. This seems to work in many cases. But recently I've found these references from classic texts that indicate other rules to follow.

After all the speculation is said and done, the answers should be obvious based on practical example, which we'll explore in tomorrow's article:


contd...



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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 28 Jun 2012

An Infamous Case of Planetary War
April 5, 2006
Vedic Astrology Diary Archives

By Vaughn Paul Manley, M.A.

A planetary war, or graha yuddha, occurs in a chart when two planets (other than the Sun, Moon, Rahu. and Ketu) are within 1 degree of one another. This is a controversial topic in Vedic astrology because there are conflicting methods given, in both modern and classic texts, for determining which planet wins the war and what the effects are.

The following is an infamous case of planetary war in the chart of Adolf Hitler. In his 7th house in the sign of Aries, Venus and Mars are in a planetary war. Venus is at 24 degrees 22 minutes longitude and Mars is at 24 degrees 4 minutes. A commonly held method for determining who wins is to proclaim the planet with the lowest degrees or longitude the winner. In this case Mars would win, which is said to give strength to the winning planet and weakens the losing planet.



Hitler's Natal Chart

In Hitler's early life he aspired to be an artist, represented by Venus, but failed miserably. He later became an absolute dictator by force, and the epitomy of a war monger, represented by Mars. He never married but did claim in speeches that the reason for this was because he was "married to the German people." In any case, let's just say he wasn't a very romantic or affectionate person. After all, he was responsible for death of over 30 million people! For these reasons, it does make logical sense that Mars won the war, grew in strength, and Venus lost and was weakened.

It should be noted that Venus is also closely aspected by Saturn in addition to being conjunct with Mars. Mars additionally increases in strength due to being in a ruchaka mahapurusha yoga. Both Mars and Venus are involved in multiple raja yogas and dana yogas with Mercury, the Sun and Saturn. These are factors that do play into the effect of Mars and Venus.

Another method for determining who wins the war is to see which planet is the most northerly. That planet will win the war according to some texts. Some say that this refers to latitude while others say that this refers to declination. Some software programs, like Sri Jyoti Star, will give latitude and declination along with degrees or longitude. Panchanga's or Indian ephemeris's will also give these calculations, but not western ephemeris's typically. According to latitude, Venus is at 6 degrees 20 minutes and Mars is at 0 degrees 9 minutes. Venus wins the war. In terms of declination, Venus is at 22 degrees 54 minutes, while Mars is at 16 degrees 54 minutes. Venus again wins the war. Another method is to give the planet with brighter rays the status of victor. In this case, Venus always wins.

Planetary war is a area that should be researched. It's confusing that there are so many opinions about it. One thing that I appreciate about K.N. Rao's approach to Vedic astrology is that he relies on practical research, and hard core results, not dogma. If a method or principle given in classical texts doesn't work based on your experience with a series of charts then don't use it.

I agree with his views wholly. Infact in the example chart of Hitler, Venus the LL is in Martian sign and also conjuncts it. so naturally martian qualities would dominate. Let us make astrology simplistic!

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Re: Planetary War

Post by anuradha » 28 Jun 2012

As per the birth details of Mr Pranab Mukherjee, Moon is in M.B[ As per Jatakparijaat, Sarawali and Sarwarth Chintamani] , Mercury is also in M.B and under the P.W with Venus. He is under Saturn- Venus-Moon.
In case of BIG B, Sun[7L] is in M.B and closely conjunct with Mercury[ Less than one degree] in 8H.
In case of Mr Einstein Moon and Ketu are in M.B.
Bush Sr. Ketu and Mars are at same degrees in 7H, and Saturn is in M.B.
http://www.journalofastrology.com/artic ... cle_id=317
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Sir, Pele was born on 21st October 1940, if you see the transit of that day, Saturn and Jupiter were in retrograde Motion and at same degrees. Mars and Rahu were also at same degrees.regards
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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 28 Jun 2012

If a method or principle given in classical texts doesn't work based on your experience with a series of charts then don't use it.

Works for me. I use it.
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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 28 Jun 2012

Anu Ji,

I understand what you are pointing at. What most of astrologers do is, fit the concepts in results! I remember an anecdote.

Once there lived a king who was a fine archer.He went to forest one day. There he saw many trees where the arrows were right on target. He wondered and enquired about this apt archer and found him finally.

King asked him "what is your secret sir? I my self after years of practice could not hit the target all the times, but how do you do this?

The archer replied" It's easy, I shoot the arrow first, then draw the target around it" :)

This is what happens most in post mortem astrology! The results have come already and we fit that with our drawings.

Better to try in advance and see the results. For Ex. US Elections 2012 is about to happen on November 4th 2012.

We have now the correct chart of Obama, and let us predict in advance, and discuss it here. Also see the transit on the day !
Last edited by krishnagopal1968 on 28 Jun 2012, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Planetary War

Post by anuradha » 28 Jun 2012

King asked him "what is your secret sir? I my self after years of practice could not hit the target all the times, but how do you do this?

The archer replied" It's easy, I shoot the arrow first, then draw the target around it"
So true. :lol:
Better to try in advance and see the results. For Ex. US Elections 2014 is about to happen on November 4th 2012.

We have now the correct chart of Obama, and let us predict in advance, and discuss it here. Also see the transit on the day
Sure I will. regards
A person should not be too honest. Straight trees are cut first and honest people are screwed first.
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Going under water with a torch to seek for a drowning man.”

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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 28 Jun 2012

Thanks for the reply anu ji.

there was a typo in my last post, it was US Elections 2012 and not 2014.

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 29 Jun 2012

T.C. Krishna gopal 1968.JPG

by krishnagopal1968 » Wed Jun 06, 2012 1:13 am
Last but not the least astrology itself :lol:


do you find Jyotishya a joke? it seems to be the case.

you are not a fit candidate to discuss jyotishya.

why do you dabble with a serious topic of Jyotishya Krishna gopal? why dont you find a channel for your restless mind, if diametrically opposite to astrology the more the better.
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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 29 Jun 2012

Dear Astroboy,

The point i wrote "Last not but least astrology itself" was in context with the sleepless nights a client faces and usual responses from our modern astrologers.

I also admitted that i should have written "too much astrology itself".

Also the solution i gave to choose something opposite is just to help real astrology, because our minds can not find anything new if we go on clinging to one thing continuosly,it needs rest. And i didn't mean to leave astrology or not discuss.

For me Astrology is a sincere topic but not serious because whenever we say "serious" our egos come in.

And i don't write here for any catharsis!

I do it to be part of the ‘gang’, for a connection and response among fellow astrologers and sometimes to have an independent platform for rebuttal.

So, if whatever i say has a truth in it, it will sink in, even one reacts to it and whatever you say has truth in it, vice-versa.

An Astrological analysis or prediction need not be for any self respect or self image.

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 29 Jun 2012

Then read the "Brihat Samhita", and the "Surya Siddhanta" and Get back to me. P.V.N.Rao ji is not a fool to have a planetary war tab and that too, with all the 9 Grahas included. I stick to my stand that any graha that is within 1 degree of The nodes are in serious trouble. The proof is there for all to see. I am yet to come to a conclusion as to who wins a war between two Grahas. I am clear that in a war between a Node and Graha, the Node always has its way at the end.

If you are serious about Jyotishya, please analyse Timothy Mc Veigh's chart, without using Graha Yuddha and the concepts I have used in my posts, and enlighten this forum, and me, and show us why MC veigh acted and died the way he did.

If you can't do a post mortem - you are unfit to operate on the living.
Through hard work and spiritual practices, a person gets honor and dignity. The lazy one who puts in no efforts is like a fool who allows salt to be spilled on the wounds of his misfortunes. The idler depending only on fate, achieves nothing. - K.N.Rao ji

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 29 Jun 2012

As Far as Hitler is concerned, It has always been my dream to analyse his chart on this forum. When I do so, I shall do it in style. I shall show You how Kuja won the war with Shukra and ultimately took hitler to his grave, just like that Ruchaka Yoga had promised.

Remember this K.G.1968 - In a war, Nobody wins or loses. In the end war Is futile. Remember Ashoka? The same is the case with the Grahas.
Through hard work and spiritual practices, a person gets honor and dignity. The lazy one who puts in no efforts is like a fool who allows salt to be spilled on the wounds of his misfortunes. The idler depending only on fate, achieves nothing. - K.N.Rao ji

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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 29 Jun 2012

AB,

As stated before,I don't believe in much post mortem. Yes your statement is right in a way but have you not come to a point that it is good to go for advance predictions at least once in while?! Like what i suggested for US elections 2012?

And why to go for analysis of criminal's charts like hitler etc, It will make us to spread or participate in more negativity, by seeing or comparing that with charts of other mini-hitlers!

Also if i remember rightly, you have already done that in one of your posts 'Upachaya houses..'!

Yes wars are futile but only we realise it in the end provided our egos allow us to see the futility.

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Re: Planetary War

Post by anxious2711 » 13 Jul 2012

Has any been able to get the TOB of Anders Behring Breivik?

When we look at his moon chart, there isn't anything that hints toward such acts he committed. Yogakaraka Mars is exalted (granted in 6th from Moon) so is Jupiter, the other Trikona lord (in 12th house). Furthermore, Saturn and Sun are in Parivartana.
There are no graha yuddha and only Mercury is combust. The only harm one can see is the conjunction of Saturn and Moon with Rahu (Moon could be in a papa kartari yoga or a graha yuddha depending on TOB) and the conjunction of Sun and Mercury with Ketu. None of these conjunction are close enough to damage the native to this extent.
The planetary positions per se do not hint to such deeds, could it be the Ascendant rising degree (gadanta concept) or does anyone have any other suggestions?

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 13 Jul 2012

by anxious2711 » Sat Jul 14, 2012 2:23 am
Has any been able to get the TOB of Anders Behring Breivik?
http://www.lightonvedicastrology.com/ph ... 42&t=11676
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Re: Planetary War

Post by Dev » 13 Jul 2012

Dear Krishna:

That is very interesting topic that you have taken up. If Paulji's point of view is right, then I would be happy since ketu is close to jupiter and venus to sun and both would be cancelled, I mean there would not be any planetary war in these cases.

However, there are other views as others and you yourself pointed out that all planets are considered and that too some consider one with higher degree as having one and some the lower degree one.
It is very difficult to come to a conclusion and choose the right one.
May be one should take the one that he feels is right for him

Dev

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 13 Jul 2012

T.C. Myeloid leukemia.jpg
T.C. Myeloid leukemia - 1.jpg
T.C. Myeloid leukemia - 2.jpg
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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 13 Jul 2012

This is the chart of a person who died of Chronic Meyeloid leukemia in May 1990. Note the afflictions to the Lagna lord, Chandra and Ravi. All three Lagnas are afflicted.

Note the exact conjunction of Budha, Ketu and Shukra in a Maraka house aspecting the 8th house of Longevity. Budha is debilitated in the Navamsha, is with the 8th lord Shukra and is with Ketu.

The dasha running at the time of death was,
T.C. Myeloid Leukemia - 3.jpg
Guru, is the 6th lord, is in the Nakshatra of Shukra (who is the 8th lord and highly afflicted by ketu) and aspects the Lagna. He is aspected by two malefics Shani and Kuja.

This is why I say that all planets are capable of going to war. Call it what you want, But two planets in the same degree or within one degree of one and the other is a cause for concern. I have said before,


by astroboy » Fri Jun 29, 2012 8:51 pm,
P.V.N.Rao ji is not a fool to have a planetary war tab and that too, with all the 9 Grahas included. I stick to my stand that any graha that is within 1 degree of The nodes are in serious trouble. I am yet to come to a conclusion as to who wins a war between two Grahas. I am clear that in a war between a Node and Graha, the Node always has its way at the end.
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Re: Planetary War

Post by krishnagopal1968 » 19 Jul 2012

Dear Dev,

Sorry for late reply, as i didnt notice your post. Yes, you are right abt paul ji's view.

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 19 Jul 2012

by Dev » Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:41 am
Dear Krishna:
That is very interesting topic that you have taken up. If Paulji's point of view is right, then I would be happy since ketu is close to jupiter and venus to sun and both would be cancelled, I mean there would not be any planetary war in these cases.
Good day Dev ji,

First of all, Shukra and Ravi are not in a Planetary war in your horoscope.

Guru and Ketu within 1 degree of each other. You can call it what you want. J hora terms it as "war", I love to call it the same. You can be your own judge and arrive at your own conclusion.

Please assess your 2nd and the 5th house on your own and come to a final conclusion.

Let me remind you, Guru being debilitated is no big deal, What matters is how close he is to a node.

Best regards,
Through hard work and spiritual practices, a person gets honor and dignity. The lazy one who puts in no efforts is like a fool who allows salt to be spilled on the wounds of his misfortunes. The idler depending only on fate, achieves nothing. - K.N.Rao ji

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Re: Planetary War

Post by anxious2711 » 19 Jul 2012

Hi AB,

I have such a chart where there are 2 graha yuddha in the same bhava, the 2nd bhava, Scorpio. Lagna lord Venus loses to Mars and Mercury loses to Sun. I can give you the details if you are interested in looking at the chart...

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Re: Planetary War

Post by Dev » 19 Jul 2012

Thanks Astroboy.

First of all, Shukra and Ravi are not in a Planetary war in your horoscope.
Ok that is good.

Guru and Ketu within 1 degree of each other. You can call it what you want. J hora terms it as "war", I love to call it the same. You can be your own judge and arrive at your own conclusion. When it comes from horse's mouth I have to accept. You have done and are doing immense research in astrology and every time come out with a quote from some book, so u can not be wrong at all.

Please assess your 2nd and the 5th house on your own and come to a final conclusion.
Let me remind you, Guru being debilitated is no big deal, What matters is how close he is to a node.
Ok so ketu has a bigger say than guru and does not allow guru to do its normal functions.

Dev

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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 19 Jul 2012

Good day Anxious 2711,

Please be kind enough to share the data and provide some feed back. As you know, I am not yet able to understand and determine the winner of a yuddha. Your data will help me understand Planetary war better.
Thanks in advance,
Best regards,
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Re: Planetary War

Post by astroboy » 19 Jul 2012

Good morning Dev ji,

Dr K.S. Charak is doing some Great research in the areas of Mrityu Bhaga and Planetary war. He clearly states that a close conjunction of two Grahas (within 1 degree- specially when a Node is involved) must be assessed carefully. I have shown many examples on this forum, where, a conjunction within 1 degree has caused damage to the native. I shall keep providing many more example as the days go by.

Thanks and Best regards,
Through hard work and spiritual practices, a person gets honor and dignity. The lazy one who puts in no efforts is like a fool who allows salt to be spilled on the wounds of his misfortunes. The idler depending only on fate, achieves nothing. - K.N.Rao ji

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Re: Planetary War

Post by 2002diksha » 19 Jul 2012

astroboyji,
can you share or publish the latest findings and latest happening with regards to planetary war and mrityu bhaga of dr Charak.
regards

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Re: Planetary War

Post by Dev » 19 Jul 2012

Thanks Astroboy. Yes, proceed with your research and it is very interesting and informative.

Dev

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