Re: Kemadruma Yoga

[chavitarun]

Thanks for very quick reply & fantastic explanation
pranam & namaskar

1. generally said natural malefic Saturn aspect on any house is not good. Here saturn is Yogkarak
& forming Sash yoga (Lord of fourth and fifth in fourth house) .will this aspect on mercury &venus in 6th ,
on 10th house and Lagna will be harmful.

2. Someone has said that debililated Ketu(Neech ka ) will be blocking Luck & it will come slow & slow

3. what about lord of a house going 12th from his house ? Saturn as a lord of 5th gone to fourth house,as
12th from a house is its loss.

[Dev]

1. generally said natural malefic Saturn aspect on any house is not good. Here saturn is Yogkarak
& forming Sash yoga (Lord of fourth and fifth in fourth house) .will this aspect on mercury &venus in 6th ,
on 10th house and Lagna will be harmful.

You have to note that sat is also a friend of sukra and budha and so such houses may not be harmed much. 10th house belongs to moon and so affliction will be there.

2. Someone has said that debililated Ketu(Neech ka ) will be blocking Luck & it will come slow & slow
You have to chant Om Gam Ganapathaye namaha and visit and pray to Lord Ganapathi regularly to overcome obstacles and problems.

3. what about lord of a house going 12th from his house ? Saturn as a lord of 5th gone to fourth house,as
12th from a house is its loss
Under normal circumstances that is true but not when the same lord has two houses nearby and he is placed in one of them when the other becomes 12th.
For eg if u take vrishchika lagna, sat represents 3rd and 4th and if sat is in 3rd ie 12th to 4th, u mean to say they will have no happiness, vehicle, home and other comforts in life. It is not true. But then the house where the planet is placed will be more active for sure but that would not deny the results of the other all together.

Dev

[chavitarun]

Thanks once agian for very quick reply & detailes explanation with example
pranam & namaskar
I am confused how to explain below Kundali without kendrum yoga in navamsha kundali
Pl. Tell whether there will be miseries & misfortune as lord of 9th gone to 8th & exchange of 7th & 8th ?

D.O.B. 30.7.1989, female 17.20PM , Beawar(Raj.) Marriage when and marital life and status of husband

what is the result of Budhatitya yoga for Sagitarius Ascendant(Dhanu lagna) in 8th house and Gajkesari yoga in 7th house . As lord of 9th in 8th and lord of 7th in 8th house .and there is also exchange of lord of 7th house and 8th house. Will it creat trouble for married life or good because it has created 2 yogas ? the native has Saturn in Lagna , Rahu in third and Venus, ketu & mars in 9th house
(Lord of 7th in 8th and lord of 9th in 8th,also in 7th gajkesari yoga and in 8th budhatiya yoga

[Dev]

See 9th lord in 8th is definitely going to cause yogabhanga or lack of luck. Atleast if the 9th house has some benefic aspects, then house could be strong. Check those in astavarga for the house and also for the planets.
But 9th and 10th together also is dharmakarmadhipati yoga which brings luck in profession. Budhaaditya yoga also is operative which means intelligence is there.
Exchange of 7th and 8th may not be good since a kendra and a dusthana.
VeMa combination could indicate more than one relationship and if one of them is strong, then even a positive favourable love marriage. I havent seen the horoscope yet and just am answering to you.
But then there are experts in this forum who can give better answers.

Dev

[chavitarun]

pl. look into Astakvarga & chart whether their is any relief with respect to Marriage & Marital Life
looking to the fact that Moon being Astmesh( Moon is free from dosha of being astmesh) sitting in 7th & Forming Gajkesari yoga.
Further Jupiter Sitting in Kendra is said to be Remover of Thousands of Doshas in Kundali.

[Dev]

See you seem to know astrology yourself.
Sun and moon are free from Astmesh dosha. Jupiter Sitting in Kendra is said to be Remover of Thousands of Doshas in Kundali.
Further jupiter is also a karaka for marriage and so is venus especially for girls.
So if one or both are strong why should you fear?
Further if I can take the liberty of asking, I would ask you why in the present day of technology and development, you worry about marriage of the girl who is hardly 21. Let her choose her direction wrt education and then u should probably try.

Dev

[chavitarun]

Respected DEV JI
I am only learner. pl. bless me so i can learn it further under guidance of Learned members.
I am worrried because some one said that she has vaivadhya yoga due to Lord of 7th gone to 8th
& Exchange of lord of 7th & 8th . further Lord of Luck gone to 8th house.
Further she has not fared well in studies upto her Graduation ,so i want to get her married
Regards & pranam

[Vic DiCara]

"Kemudaram" yoga is a very common yoga.

I disagree strongly. It is not a common yoga at all. It is somewhat common to have some half-formed version of the yoga, but the real full yoga is very uncommon.

Generally, Kemudaram yoga forms when Moon is alone in a Bhava and also the adjecent Bhavas on both side are should be empty.

This is the very basic form of the yoga, but for the full yoga to be there, (a) the moon must not be in a kendra and (b) there must not be planets (Mars through Saturn) in the Moon's kendra. Thus as you can imagine, the full yoga is extremely rare to find.

I want to know the main situation/conditions for Kemudaram yoga and also like to have a brief discussion about its effects and its effective periods.

The effect is that there is a huge lack of emotional fortitude which makes it nearly impossible to be successful in anything. The name of the yoga invokes the image of a tree which has no leaves or flowers or fruits. Such is the effect.

If the Moon is in a kendra one possess personal mental and emotional strength to significantly overcome the problems and attain emotional fortitude which is the foundation of success. If there are planets in the Moon's kendras those planets lend emotional fortitude through their natural inherent qualities and thus one can draw on those qualities and source to overcome the effect of the yoga.

If the moon is not in a kendra and there is no planet in the Moons kendra - the person will be obliterated by bad karma. "Even a king is reduced to begging."

Sri Krsna was born with a modified kemadruma yoga, but in his case the Moon was rising very prominently so yogas affecting the Moon were quite prominent. Therefore although modified, the effect was that although born in royalty he "had to" heard cows for 16 years in secrecy. Later however he became the most successful and opulent king in history. This is all external of course. Krsna's greatest happiness came during his 16 years in Vrindavan as a cow-hearder.

Jai Sri Krsna.

[krishnagopal1968]

Thanks for the post VIC.

My view too is similiar. But please clear one doubt. Instead of kendra, if planets are in trikona, is the yoga operative? I mean moon in trikona and planets in trikona to moon but not in kendra.

Also lord krishna's horoscope. BV raman gave one version, Prashant trivedi given other. What horoscope ISKCON follows? I prefer prashant's version.

There was a great debate abt Shri Prabhupad's horoscope in ISKCON right from 1990s. Then I have read Shyamsundar dasa's article and was fully satisfied. But it is sad that Sanjay rath and his followers and many others in ISKCON still stick to Dhanu lagna! Except Shri KN rao ji no indian astrologer said his is makar lagna. You too have participated in Dandavat's site if I remember and said makar lagna. Now what is finally accepted by ISKCON?

[Vic DiCara]

Dear Krishna Gopal,

My view too is similiar. But please clear one doubt. Instead of kendra, if planets are in trikona, is the yoga operative? I mean moon in trikona and planets in trikona to moon but not in kendra.

Currently my opinion is "no". The planets must be in Kendra to the Moon, the Moon must be in Kendra, to counteract the affects of the Kemadruma. Kona does not count. Also the planets must be the real planets, not the Sun, Moon, Rahu, Ketu or any other subplanet or modern thing.

Also lord krishna's horoscope. BV raman gave one version, Prashant trivedi given other. What horoscope ISKCON follows? I prefer prashant's version.

Neither person has any authority or capacity to understand Svayam Bhagavan Sri Krsna. "Tarko 'pratishtha" Only Mahajana yena gata sa pantah - one the great, great krsna-bhaktas have any intimate knowledge of Krsna all others make fools of themselves by discussing Krsna.

Bhagavat Purana, 10th skanda, 3rd dhyaya, 1st shloka tells that Krsna was born with all the stars and planets and houses in very very auspicious positions and combinations and specifically mentions the ascention of Aja-nakshatra ("Rohinii"). Several shlokas later, the Saaraartha-darshinii tika of Sripad Vishvanath Chakravarthi Thakur references an older astrological treatise named Kha Manikya (which now seems to have been lost) that gives full detail of Sri Krsna's birth chart as follows: "The Moon, Mars, Mercury and Saturn were exalted. Taurus ascended. Jupiter was in Pisces. Sun was in Leo, Venus in Libra, Rahu was in Scorpio. It was midnight, on a wednesday, while the Moon was in Rohini."

Anyone who refuses to accept this chart ought to have an exceedingly good reason why they are contradicting the guru parampara, sadhu vak, and saastra. I fully accept this chart.

I have three videos regarding interpretations of this horoscope - including the dasha cycles.

There was a great debate abt Shri Prabhupad's horoscope in ISKCON right from 1990s. Then I have read Shyamsundar dasa's article and was fully satisfied. But it is sad that Sanjay rath and his followers and many others in ISKCON still stick to Dhanu lagna! Except Shri KN rao ji no indian astrologer said his is makar lagna. You too have participated in Dandavat's site if I remember and said makar lagna. Now what is finally accepted by ISKCON?

The idea that Srila Prabhupada has Dhanu lagna, in my opinion - for whatever it is worth - is a big blunder that a specific astrologer tripped into very early in his career and people have been want to stick with this mainly out of fear of admiting a silly mistake, and partially out of unwillingness to change a cherished opinion. In my opinion it is silly.

I dont know what the official ISKCON opinion is, or if there is any.

[krishnagopal1968]

Dear VIC,

Many thanks for clearing my doubt and for the detailed clarification on Lord "Krishna"s horocope. Happy to note your views on Shri Prabhupada's lagna.

Now this forum will have some hot debates as you stepped in! Ofcourse it for better knowledge

[Vic DiCara]

I always seem to cause debate. I am sorry!

[krishnagopal1968]

No sir, I didn't mean that way. Pardon me for this error in communication.

I should have said " Constructive debate".

[Vic DiCara]

[Dev]

Dear Chavitarun:

Exchange oetween 7th and 8th I feel is much better than the 7th alone going to 8th, that would have been disasterous. Anyway have faith in God and ask her to do pariharas. Dont start worrying from nowon about marriage.
Best wishes
Dev

[P.Srinivas. Rao]

Many authors, rishis, daivajnas have explained this Kema-Druma Yoga in their own experience and jnana. Here i would like to bring the views of few well known Daivajnas only to clear the doubts of the readers and understand clearly the meaning of Kema -Druma Yoga .

As per Phaladeepika Grantha:-

NO graha with Chandra,
No graha in between Chandra ( In 2nd and 12th to Chandra)

As per Vaidyanatha:-

"Shashi, Shani,Shukra kendre sthithaha
Kujashtama, Ravi vyayagow
Kema-Druma varayom yoge jathasya janma bhoomirathaha "
Meaning:- Chandra, Shani, Shukra in kendra ( 1,4,10,7 ) from Lagna, Kuja in 8th and Ravi in 12th from lagna is called as Kema Druma Yoga

As per Chomadri:-

"Bhagyadipathi vyayasthe vyaya Shani vitthage balakshini
vikrama sthane papairyogaha Kema-Drumajneyaam "
Meaning:-9th lord in 12th along with Shani and become nirbala, papgraha in 3rd from lagna is called as Kema Druma Yoga.

As per Saaravali---Raja Yoga Ratnavali grantha---Kalyana Verma:-

There should not be Anapha, Sunapha, and Durdura yoga in jataka,
No graha in Kendra to Chandra
No graha aspects Chandra
only then, it is called as Kema -Druma yoga.

Others:-

1) No graha with Chandra,
No graha in 2nd and 12th from Chandra
No graha in Kendra (1,4,10,7 ) from Chandra
Chandra should not be aspected by Guru or Shukra both in Rashi and navamsha,
There should be papagraha in Chandras house ( Karkataka Rashi ) in rashi chakra
Papagraha should not aspects/see Chandras house ( Karkataka rashi ),
Rashiadipathi of Chandra ( both in rashi and navamsha Chakra ) should be papyuktha,
Neecha Chandra, neecha rashydipathi should be uchha and kendra to lagna
only then, it is called as " Maha Dosha Prada Kema- Druma Yoga "

2)No shubha graha in Kendra to Chandra,
Chandra should be in papa- karthari or papa Madya,
Guru or Shukra should not be astha,
If the native is born during night time , then Shukra should not be in 7th to Chandra,
If the native is born during day time, then Guru should not aspect Chandra.


As per the lesson taught to us by our Guru Sri Gunjoor Ramachandra Shastri:-

No graha with Chandra,
No graha in between Chandra ( 2nd and 12th from Chandra ),
No drishti by Guru or Shukra to Chandra,
No graha in Kendra to Chandra ,( only these 5 grahas)
This Yoga donot apply to Ravi, Rahu and Ketu,
This yoga is applicable ONLY TO KUJA, BUDHA ,GURU, SHUKRA AND SHANI ( Panchaadhi Graha only )These 5 grahas should not be in Kendra to Chandra.
THIS YOGA IS MAINLY DEPENDS ON CHANDRA.

I feel, readers can follow the last one ie:- my Gurus explanation.

To make it very clear it is better to understand ----Kema - Druma Bhanga------

After the b r e a k-----

[P.Srinivas. Rao]

Kema Druma Bhanga:-

Shubha graha should be in Kendra from Chandra
Guru or Shukra should aspects Chandra
If the native is born during day time , then Chandra should be aspected by Guru or guru should be in Kendra to Chandra
If the native is born during night time, then Shukrta should be in 7th to Chandra or Shukra should be in Kendra to Chandra
At least one graha namely --Kuja , Budha, Guru, Shukra, Shani should be in Kendra to Chandra
Guru and Shukra should not be Astha
Chandra should be in madya ( middle ) or in between to shubha graha in Rashi or in Navamsha
There should be shubha graha in 10th from lagna or Chandra
Chandra should not have papagraha yuthi or drishti
Chandra should be in Kendra to Navamsha lagna and aspected by Guru or shukra
Chandra in Uchha or swa- kshetra in rashi chakra and aspected by Guru or shukra

Only then, Kema - Druma Yoga becomes banga.

Phala of this yoga after the break----

[P.Srinivas. Rao]

Many well known Daivajnas say that , among all bad yogas , Kema - Druma yoga is the worst yoga to have.
It is much more bad than Kujashtama or Brighushatka yoga.
Whoever born in this yoga will be a --Nathadrashta ( luck/fate less ) sukha heena.
The native may not live long . Even if he lives , he has to undergo extreme poverty, chain of debts, and will be SLEEPING ON THE LAPS OF DARIDRA NARAYANA , whose life is Shoonya/zero.

This yoga mainly depends on CHANDRA.

Generally those who born in this yoga will loose their job or will end their life in searching for the job. They dont have one Nirdishta ( fixed, perticular ) jeevana. always worried. They are inclined to dukha jeevana and cannot enjoy the fruits of Sukha. Whatever the work they do, they achieve with lot of struggles and obstacles. Loose the prathi phala (results) in the middle by their wrong Karma ( actions ).

They loose their job by suspension, money wont stay in their hand even if they have . They dont get prathiphala for their work.

Always they are in Paraadeena ( depends on others ) jeevana. The job wont stay for long even if they are self - employed. It is impossible to get the higher post or job. Some times they create tensions , ashaanthi around their surroundings by their ahankaar, darpa and ego. always they roam for one or the other reasons.

This yoga gives mostly during the Dasha period.

Chandra is maathtra karaka. Those who are born during night time , Chandra becomes the Pitra Karaka. With this reason, this yoga gives much effect to their mother and father.

That is why Chandra always should have the association / sambandha of Natural benefics like budha , shukra, Guru.. Only then Chandra can able to give good phala in jataka.

Even if the malefics are in 2 -12 to Chandra, these grahas gives the trouble to Chandra and hence the native may not have good bhavishya. Meaning Chandra should not be in papakartari yoga.

This yoga comes from ones Prarabda Karma. Only Bagawantha van rescue the native . This is said by Varahamihira-----

"Kema Druma malina dukhitha neechaniswaha
prestya katascha nrapatheresi vamsha jathaha "

a person even if if is born in Raja Vamsha, he will have to suffer from dukha, malina , dainyatha ( extending hands for others help ) by this yoga.

Main Phala Of Kema - Druma Yoga :-

Nithya Daaridrya ( extreme poverty ) as told by Parashara, Chomaadri, Kalyana Varma and Vaidyanatha.

Next , the explanation of this yoga with an example of one Kema Druma Jataka --------

[anuradha]

Sir, Its great to see you back. I am posting the details of a chart having kemdruma yoga, to have your comments. Date of birth March 9, 1961, 00-54a.m, Mathura[ U.P] . Regards

[thirthachengappa]

Anuradha Ji, you have provided an excellent and a very interesting horoscope for study. I am eager to hear what the state of this person is. Both the trine lords are in debilitation and the Neecha Bhanga is not worth commenting upon. Chandra is comatose and Guru is in a persistent vegetative state. Chandra does not even achieve a Neecha Bhanga, leave alone a Raja Yoga.Saving grace is that the LL is exalted in the D9.

[Dev]

Sir:

I have read that when chandra is in the lagna, then chandra being in kendra also cancels the kemadruma yoga.
In my case, I am running chandra dasa and most of what you said, I have not observed, though of course, lack of luck definitely. But otherwise, there is no poverty, I am only helping others by giving money and dont ask anyone for money. I have never tried to even take loan from others till today except may be under may be 2-3 occassions that too during college study. Only effects I have is bad luck and isolation. I hate to be isolated but it is so due to this yoga. I am unable to mingle with others due to the happenings around which is clearly due to kemadruma yoga.

Dev
Feb 1, 62 New Delhi 2.30am

[swamykool]

Srinivas ji,

The moment I came back, the first thing I saw was your new post. This is extremely good nimitta for me, in my opinon. Welcome back guru ji. May your contributions enrich us all for a long time to come.

Regards
swamykool

[milredr]

Yes Sir. Its indeed an honor to have u back.

Regards

[thirthachengappa]

Vic ji, just to stir the hornets’ nest a little Don’t you think Dhanu lagna explains Prabhupada's life better? He as we know was a prolific writer, if lagna was Makara, don’t you think Guru in the 8th would have dampened his writing spirit?

[thirthachengappa]

Dev » Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:47 am
Sir:
I have read that when chandra is in the lagna, then chandra being un kendra also cancels the kemadruma yoga

.

Is correct sir. Even in the example provided by Anu ji, Chandra is in Lagna, But the Neecha Bhanga is weak. I have not seen your Horo, I cannot comment. But your are right when you say, Chandra in lagna cancels Kema Druma Yoga.