Saturn

[intstud]

Why does Sat represent slowness and old age when he's the son of Sun, who represents youth and vitality? I mean, shouldn't he be considered more youthful than his father?

[elipsis]

Sun cursed Saturn for a crime he didn't commit - his legs became paralyzed as he begged for forgiveness. So Sun assigned him the position of a planet and the name Shanischara (slow mover) got stuck. And this is why saturn hates injustice upon people- he is fond of ordinary people. Rulers can never understand the plight of the hardworking and old people so Saturn positions himself strongly with the masses and trains them to become less dependent on the rulers.

But Sun and Saturn aren't enemies like people think they are, they never fought with each other and got along quite well but there are only ideological differences which vedic astrology takes into account. Same goes to Jupiter and Venus.

[intstud]

Ah..cool. That's a very good explanation.
I've always been drawn towards Sat...God alone knows why. Even, say, a decade ago...when I hardly knew anything about astro, I felt a lotta respect for Sat.

[Ekalavya]

Dear elipsis ji,
Thanks a lot for this info
but,

Sun cursed Saturn for a crime he didn't commit - his legs became paralyzed as he begged for forgiveness.

Why did he beg for forgiveness when he din' actually commit the crime?

[intstud]

Was Saturn a child at that point of time?

[elipsis]

Dear elipsis ji,
Thanks a lot for this info
but,

Sun cursed Saturn for a crime he didn't commit - his legs became paralyzed as he begged for forgiveness.

Why did he beg for forgiveness when he din' actually commit the crime?

He felt that was the most sensible thing to do because arguments would have landed him in more trouble and besides he didn't want his father to lose.

Was Saturn a child at that point of time?

No idea...maybe not.

[KET]

Elipsis ji

You are partly right on Shanneshwaran story.... Sun didnot curse Shani... Sun was ignorant about Shani's side

I need to elaborate... Sanjana..... Chaya.... Yama, Yamuna also apart from Shani and Sandyavandanam... I will include it later part of the day......

Only two persons have been titled as Eeswaran....on par with Shiva... Shiva also known as Parameswaran. .

The two persons are also strong Shiv Bhakts
1. Ravaneshwaran.... when he shook kailash whete Shiva abodes... Shiva pressed with toe finger... when Ravana was lifting kailash mountain.... in order not to be crushed under Shiva... Ravanan tore his thigh nrrvs and played Veena and Chanted Samaveda and Ganam... Shiva pleases with Samaganam and Veena recital.... Shiva bestoed him title of Ravaneshwaran

2. Second person is Shani.... Shiva bestoed Shani with Shaneeswaran... for looking into Karma of every person in his or her life.Even Lord Shiva for seven seconds was affected by Shani's work. No one can escape from Shaneeshwaran

Regds

[elipsis]

If I remember the story correctly - chaya cursed yama and he was made God of death by Shiva. Tapati became river and Saturn became planet. I remember reading Sun cursing saturn in the beginning for being illegitimate or something.

[R V RAMANAN]

Only Ravana merged with Lord Shiva and hence called Ravaneshwara....Shani did not get the title Eshwara...It is shanaischara ...which slowly became shaneeswara..shaniaschara means a slow mover....

Regards
ramanan

[intstud]

The information available online just cannot be trusted. Some articles about Saturn have totally distorted the actual story.
It's like a game of Chinese Whispers....apples eventually turn to oranges.

[KET]

Instud..... please dont refer webpages and comments... when three persons ,RVR,Elipsis, and me dwell on subject... we have undergone through Puranas and not from some crazy links. I request you to understand and digest the essence of our discussion

Elipsis I will come back to Sanjana/Chaya and Saturn story...though the later part of Saturn and Shiva are connected with Surya and Chaya lineage. I will answer now the point raised on Shaneeswaran

Sun or Ravi took Saturn to Lord Shiva for assigning responsibilities to Saturn... as others like Yama, Agni, Vayu etc their responsibilities been assigned by Lord Shiva. Lord Shiva assigned Saturn as a planet /Graha to look after one's karma after looking at his past deeds. As Saturn been cursed by his mother or deformity and hence slow mover( apprx it takes 2.5 yrs Saturn to move into next Rashi), Shiva also blessed him , his (Saturn) gaze falls on a person, depending on his deeds a person will have the effect of minimum 7.5 seconds to 7.5 years of this period one will understand the sufferings and come back to dharmic role. Saturn was pleased, and he requested this blessing he would like to test on Parameshwaran itself.Parameshwaran accepted challege... he said Saturn your gaze will not fall on him for next 7.5 years. Lord Shiva moved across 7 worlds.... he could sense Saturn gaze catching up... Shiva went underneath oceans.. still his gaze was following him.... Lord Shiva hid behind black hair tress of Goddess Parvati... Saturn called out Lord Shiva and accepted his defeat. Lord Shiva came out behind from Parvati's tress of hair.Saturn said... Parameshwara ...I won the challenge... Shiva asked him how..... Saturn said for 7 minutes.... you ran from your abode to eveywhere and finally you locked behind mother's hair.... 7 minutes my gaze was behind you... Lord blessed Saturn and said you will be called as Shaneeswaran, person worshipping Lord Shiva during saturn dosha or Sadesati Shani.... miseries will be reduced and gave him adhipati for kumbha(mool trikone.... a kama house) and also for makara.... natural zodiac.... karmasthana.........From his mooltrikone sign... natural zodiac....Saturn aspects.... 5th sign... mooltrikone sign for Ravi...purvajanmasthan....... a Dharma sthan

Therefore....Hanuman... avatar of Lord Shiva...... worshipped by natives who are having issues with Saturn, Shani Pradosham is another remedialmeasure.... during this pradosham.... most of the doshas get rectified when one appeases Lord Shiva on Shani Pradosham.

It is also imperative from above story... on Saturday... one should not have haircuts nor nailcutting.... one of the karaka for hair/skin/nail..... Saturn.......

[intstud]

KET...that's exactly what I meant when I made that statement. I wanted make other readers realize that online sources cannot be trusted.

[srcs]

@Ket; Another allegorical tale for sani a karaka for limbs. As 11th house shows realisation of ambitions/assures
victory Ravana tried to put all the planets in 11th when his son Indrajit was to be born.But sani stretched his
legs to the 12th house to save Devas by misfortune to indrajit which otherwise he may become invincible.Ravana
cut the legs of sani but before that Indrajit was born.That's why sani plays a part in paralytic attacks/limbs problems etc. Few authors say sani is Brahma .But it is not all convincing seeing the role sani plays in human lives.
He is siva rudra.sani is donning the role of siva&that's why Navagrahas are kept only in siva temples.
Also sani is known as Neelan&siva is Neela kantan.Sun/guru may be taken as brahma.
Sani is sanaischara is the correct sanskrit word.(slow motion)

[Gopal Bhardwaj]

There is an incident connecting Hanuman and Saturn. As per the belief, Ravan knew that he has drishti of saturn and it will lead to his death. He captured saturn and imprisoned him under his royal chair. When Hanuman's tail was set on fire in Rajmahal of Ravana, Hanuman started burning the things around the darbaar. During this chaos, Hanuman saw something dark beneth the royal chair of ravan. Hanuman tore apart the chair and freed Saturn from the captivity of Ravana. Saturn then blessed Hanumaan that whoever will prey Hanuman on saturday will get blessings of Saturn also. Saturn again had drishti on ravana and ravana's fate was sealed.

As per another story, when lord krishna was born, all devta's came to see him and to bless him. Shani dev also came but he was stopped by the mother yashoda as she feared that drishti of saturn will be bad for her son. Shanidev felt very dishearted. But, lord krishna contacted him through his secret voice and advised him to stay at Kokilaban outside nandgaon and promised him that he will come himself and will meet him there. Shanidev stayed at Kokilaban and started dhyaan there. Late on during his childhood, lord krishna came to kokilaban for feeding his cows and met Shanidev. shanidev became very pleased after meeting with lord krishna. He also blessed that place and said that if someone visits that place once in his life, he will be freed from all the griefs.

These two are foretold stories as told by my father. He was a great admirer of saturn.

[KET]

Elipsis ji

Now the point raised Shaneeswaran and my references cited, I guess it is resolved.

We will now look at Sanjana.... Saturn... Ravi... Sandyavandanam tale

Sanjana daughter of Vishwakarma,Indrolok architect consultant Sanjana was great Shiv bhakt. As she attained her marriage age, Vishwakarma approached Ravi or Surya for him to be soninlaw. Surya agreed and Sanjana.. Surya got married. Sanjana after few months of marriage could not able to tolerate Surya heat and glare.... she was beautiful prior to marriage, after marriage her skin tone turned to dusky or twilight color... many devatas called her also as Sandhya.

Because of unberable heat with Sun, She made a dummy or clone of her and named as Chhaya.... informing Chhayadont tell Surya you are my dummy and live with him till I come back. She left and Chhaya took care of Sun.. after months... Chhaya delivered a boy.. dark in complexion and dull type.. she named kid as Shani /manthan . Vishwakarma came to know about saturn's birth... he asked Sanjana... how come you are here and Saturn is born there... Sanjana narrated everything... Sanjana was asked to go back to Surya... Sanjana came back, destroyed her dummy but kept Chhaya's illusion. Sanjana neglected Shani all the time.... After that she delivered two kids one male.... Yama and female ....Yamuna..

They grew up.... being devatas... Sun wanted to discuss with Shiva their responsibilities.... Sun informef Yama should be for taking care of lives of people... and Yamuna was given the sancity of holy river... Sanjana had already instructed Sun not to give responsibility to Shani

Feeling humiliation.... Shani kicked Sanjana's navel part... Sanjana cursed Shani... the leg should get severed from your torso... Surya was astonished to see these acts... Sanjana narrated story.....Sun did not find Shani as illegitimate child... he fused Shani's leg in his torso... still that lameness was not remediated.... Shani known for slowness... than IT had narrated the story of Shani..... Shiva

Sanjana left from Surya's abode to live seperately..... she livef in forest disguised herself as mare.... Surya came to know about Sanjana living in forest as mare.... he came down there.... he disguised himself as horse... Sanjana recognised her husband.. Surya and Sandhya's fusion resulted again birth of twins... Ashwanikumars..... known as Dhanwantri or healing God..Ashwani kumars also sits in the horse chariot of Sun....... morning rays and evening rays.... person worship first ray of the morning and last rays of Sun...... arghyam is given...... Sandhyavandanam resulted... apart from worshipping Sun in madhyanika... strong rays... madhyanika sandhyavandanam... Gayatri mantras are utteted after saluting necessary devatas in Sandhyavandanam
Hence Sun or Ashwanikumars........ good vitality of health

Regds

[elipsis]

Oh I see, that's what happened. Thanks Ket ji- you are a good story teller.

[KET]

ohh.thanks.

If one is a good story teller..... subject should be known thoroughly and also communication

[Ekalavya]

I'd like to thank all the respected members who contributed to this thread _/\_
very interesting as well as informative posts