I think it's impossible to believe that lagna lord in the 11th house will give an elder sibling in every single instance. I think it may not be so, always because there are always exceptions to rules.
Yes, I agree with you that it is impossible in every single instance. The chart that rehr presented shows afflictions to the 11th lord by being debilitated in 10th house and the markesh aspect of Saturn on 11th house which rules out any elder siblings, etc. I asked abortion because venus has attained neechbhanga due to mercury also there.
The book, that I have, says that lagnesh lord in 11th house can mean help through elder brothers. There are also other factors which tells us how to find out whether a native has younger or elder siblings. I have applied these factors in the charts that I have and had success in 99% cases.
Telepathy is an example of this theory of the power of desire working in our lives: we think deeply about someone, and that person contacts us that very moment or sometime soon—it’s said that our desire to contact the person makes the person contact us. These things make us start wondering if it’s all predestined, or free will is something, which we all have, and which we all exercise from time to time.
Yes I have seen telepathy works but it does not happen all the time. For instance, a person has a break up and he is constantly thinking about her, longing to see her but she never contact him. Here in this case, telepathy won't work. I think and strongly believe that telepathy works only when there is strong attachment in each other.
Sometimes, it also happens like this that when we are in a crisis and we call God for help, He comes to the rescue. Is that predestined too that we will pray to God and God will help us get over a crisis or help in fulfilling our wishes? It maybe is so, because we see a lot of times that our prayers to God, sometimes doesn't bring any result—the help from God doesn't come. So can that mean that He is partial? No, whatever it is, we can be free of doubt that God is not partial—it is impossible to even think that He can be partial. So why is it that some people get His help, and some don't? Does it again mean that divine help received by some is also destined, that is, it is a fruit of good karma done in some previous life? I don't know exactly what it is, and I wonder if anyone knows for sure. The mystery has remained and will always remain, different people giving different opinions on it.
A very interesting observation made by you. It is a mystery why God helps some and others not. I think the best way to answer it is from Bhagvad Gita and you may be having the qoute also with you. It said that God protects and takes care of those who take shelter in Him. Here a person who surrenders himself to God has no ego with Him. It is just like having a Godfather in a company. The more we butter our Godfather, the more he takes care of our needs.
deeps wrote:Yes, I agree with you that it is impossible in every single instance. The chart that rehr presented shows afflictions to the 11th lord by being debilitated in 10th house and the markesh aspect of Saturn on 11th house which rules out any elder siblings, etc. I asked abortion because venus has attained neechbhanga due to mercury also there.
The book, that I have, says that lagnesh lord in 11th house can mean help through elder brothers. There are also other factors which tells us how to find out whether a native has younger or elder siblings. I have applied these factors in the charts that I have and had success in 99% cases.
Yes, all factors need to be considered as you have rightly said--just checking the placement of lagna lord in the 11th house won't give the correct picture. The strength of the 11th lord is to be seen as you have considered in the chart, you have written about.
I am glad to hear that you have had success in 99% cases. It's a remarkable success rate, achieved by very few astrologers.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
deeps wrote:Yes I have seen telepathy works but it does not happen all the time. For instance, a person has a break up and he is constantly thinking about her, longing to see her but she never contact him. Here in this case, telepathy won't work. I think and strongly believe that telepathy works only when there is strong attachment in each other.
Yes, telepathy doesn't work always as firstly the thinking has to be deep, and secondly, there has to be a connection between the two as you have rightly stated. If I think day and night about a movie star, who doesn’t know me personally, she will not try to contact me ever, but it can be like this that one day I meet her because of the strength of my desire.
Coming to the example you have given of a guy remembering the girl he loved after breakup has happened, and the girl not replying back, well, here, ego comes in, so even the girl maybe is thinking about the guy at that very moment, she decides against contacting him as a breakup has already happened between them.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
deeps wrote:A very interesting observation made by you. It is a mystery why God helps some and others not. I think the best way to answer it is from Bhagvad Gita and you may be having the qoute also with you. It said that God protects and takes care of those who take shelter in Him. Here a person who surrenders himself to God has no ego with Him. It is just like having a Godfather in a company. The more we butter our Godfather, the more he takes care of our needs.
I am not sure if it's so always. I agree that it is written in Bhagavad Gita that if one surrenders oneself completely to God, He will definitely help him in his times of difficulty, but I have seen God helping me even when I have not thought of Him and not asked for any help from Him. It's when I have asked for help earnestly that no help had come! So I am not sure why it is like that in my case. I have always felt that God wants me to be independent rather than be dependent on Him. I am not sure of other's experience in regard to their connection with God, but it would be interesting to hear it from them if they are willing to share.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
Yes, telepathy doesn't work always as firstly the thinking has to be deep, and secondly, there has to be a connection between the two as you have rightly stated. If I think day and night about a movie star, who doesn’t know me personally, she will not try to contact me ever, but it can be like this that one day I meet her because of the strength of my desire.
Well about meeting a movie star, I think that if you are destined to meet, then you will surely meet. My parents and I never desired to meet Tom Alter, Begum and Anupam Kher but still we met them. I mean we never harboured any desire to meet them.
I feel we have an answer in astrology itself. I read, but not sure, that 11th house is the house of fulfillment of desires. Isn't that so?
Last edited by deeps on 05 Jul 2012, edited 1 time in total.
but I have seen God helping me even when I have not thought of Him and not asked for any help from Him. It's when I have asked for help earnestly that no help had come! So I am not sure why it is like that in my case.
I am not sure if God helped you when you did not send SOS to Him. I mean i have seen many cases with myself God coming to my help immedaitely when I prayed very deeply. But at many times, I got helps without asking any for it from Him. I attribute these unexpected helps to luck factor or strong combinations in a chart like strong 9th house.
deeps wrote:Well about meeting a movie star, I think that if you are destined to meet, then you will surely meet. My parents and I never desired to meet Tom Alter, Begum and Anupam Kher but still we met them. I mean we never harboured any desire to meet them.
I feel we have an answer in astrology itself. I read, but not sure, that 11th house is the house of fulfillment of desires. Isn't that?
I agree that you meet them whom you are destined to meet. It's interesting to know though that you and your parents met some celebrities. I only wish to meet my favourite actress. I hope I do meet her one day and can take a picture standing beside her as is said in one of the latest ads that's it's no more a time for autographs but photographs.
Yes, 11th house is the house of fulfilment of desires, I agree.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
Tell me one thing why 11th house is an evil house? I think strong 3rd and 11th house gives too much desires in a native and a strong will to fulfill them?
Last edited by deeps on 05 Jul 2012, edited 1 time in total.
deeps wrote:I am not sure if God helped you when you did not send SOS to Him. I mean i have seen many cases with myself God coming to my help immedaitely when I prayed very deeply. But at many times, I got helps without asking any for it from Him. I attribute these unexpected helps to luck factor or strong combinations in a chart like strong 9th house.
Well, that is a good point you have made that a strong 9th house, which means luck in your side, can also be the reason for help when it is needed. Maybe, that is how it has been in my case, but I will still prefer to call it God's help than to say it is my destiny.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
deeps wrote:Tell me oen thing why 11th house is an evil house?
The main reason 11th house has been considered an evil house is, it is the strongest of kama houses, and it is also the strongest of the trishadaya houses, which are evil houses. The houses, which bring obstacles to spiritual development has been considered evil in astrology, and the houses which helps in spiritual growth has been considered benefic, like the 1st, 5th and 9th houses are all benefic as they are all dharma houses.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
deeps wrote:I think strong 3rd and 11th house gives too much desires in a native and a strong will to fulfill them?
That is so because they are kama houses.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
The main reason 11th house has been considered an evil house is, it is the strongest of kama houses, and it is also the strongest of the trishadaya houses, which are evil houses. The houses, which bring obstacles to spiritual development has been considered evil in astrology, and the houses which helps in spiritual growth has been considered benefic, like the 1st, 5th and 9th houses are all benefic as they are all dharma houses.
It really makes sense as I read in one of the articles that affliction to 11th house or lord is a must for spiritual advancement. Thanks for explaining it it very clearly. By the way, what does the word "trishadaya" means? I have not been able to find its meaning.
I finally managed to remember a birth details of an aged lady, who consulted me sometime in the middle of 2010. Her details-
5-jul-1950
Time between 4 to 6am (i don't remember exactly)
Gemini Lagna and Kumbh Rashi.
This lady had been sufferings at the hands of her hostile daughter at law, even facing some minor violence like burning on hands. She consulted through someone close to me. I casted the horocope and seeing the malefics afflicting 4th house of domestic happiness, I realized that it was hopeless for her and she would have to suffer more at home.
I did not tell this but told her I would tell her tomorrow. I kept looking at the chart all the time and looked for yogas that could have save her from unnecessary troubles.
I noticed a strong Gajkesari Yoga and the Venus mahadasha in 12th house of ashram,about to start. I thought her time had come to join ashram.
The next day I told her that domestic unhappiness was there till her lifetime. But I told her that time had come for her to give up the household life and join some ashram. I also told others about it.
The next 2 years were very bad for her, her health was deteriorating day by day and people were asking me what happened would happen to her. However, I did not reply anything.
This year in May'12, things became very terrible with her daughter in law threatning her to throw her out of the house. Her relatives even tried everything to mend the relations but failed. Finally, the person remembered my prediction and the search started for ashram who would accept her. They found Gayatri Pariwar and within few days, every formality was completed and she was shifted there. After almost 2 months, she looks much happier and brighter, though she knows she does not have much time left.
What does "free will" really mean? It’s the will to do what we wish to do. It’s a choice that we have with us. So we see that free will is nothing but the implementation of the thought that comes up in our mind. Now, sometimes we see that though we have a thought, we don’t get it implemented, so in that case it is said that we didn’t use our free will, even though we could, just out of indolence. So we see here that free will is about thinking and about implementing that thought.
Now, let us for a change come to astrology, which is the science of the study of the planets, and their effect on our lives. Does astrology have a say in regard to our thinking, in regard to the efforts we put in life? Yes, it does! Mercury rules our intelligence in astrology, and Moon rules our mind, and 4th and 5th house in a birth chart rules our mind and intellect respectively. Now, coming to efforts, Mars signifies that and so does the 3rd house. What do we infer from this? It’s very simple that the thoughts that come to our mind, the efforts that we put in life are not in our hands because it’s in the hands of the planets that control our lives, which proves for us that the so called free will is actually the will of the planets.
Now, let us talk about astrology. If we read the books on astrology, both the classics and also the books written by modern authors based on what the classics have said, or if we read the articles on astrology written by the modern astrologers, do we ever come across the word “free will” or any synonym of that in their writing?
Take the example of the astrological classic, "Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra", which is considered to be the bible of astrology: we find numerous planetary combinations stated there, giving different effects. We read about the different dashas, and the various effects they give. Do we even a single time get to read anywhere that the planetary combinations will give result only if efforts are put by the person, that is, the result of the planetary combinations, the results of the planetary dashas are subject to the person putting efforts? If we see all the astrology books that are available in the market, I don’t think we will find a single one in which it is stated that the effect of the planets will be felt only if the person puts his own efforts—otherwise not.
Read the astrological analysis of charts discussed in various books and try to find out even one of them, where it states that a person had success due to some auspicious combination, or failure due to some inauspicious combination in a chart only after the person had put effort in that regard? I don’t think it will be possible to find such a line in any of the astrological analysis of charts in any book or article because astrology doesn’t take into consideration free will at all. So we can rule out this theory that the planets give their effect only when efforts are put.
Now, how much can a birth chart say? If we read the astrology books, we find that a birth chart with its 9 planets, 12th houses and 27 nakshatras talk about every sphere of our life. Coming to the dashas that a person will experience in his life, it is broken down to 5 levels, with the dasha in the 5th level being of 2-3 days periods, and which means that every day of our life are in control of the planets.
We have in of our previous paragraphs have showed that astrology doesn’t talk about the planets giving their results subject to human effort, rather the efforts that one puts are also predestined as there are planets and houses suggesting that. So what do we infer from this? Destiny is totally predestined if we believe astrology is true. Now, for those who believe in free will, they don’t believe in astrology as well—they don’t bother about the planets and their roles in their lives. For them, only difficult times can show to them that things are not in their hands as they think, they are.
Last edited by basab14 on 05 Jul 2012, edited 2 times in total.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
but I will still prefer to call it God's help than to say it is my destiny.
well, what is the difference between God and destiny. After all, God is the controller of everything in the universe.
Deeps,
The difference between God and destiny is, God is the controller, destiny is the instrument of control.
Last edited by basab14 on 05 Jul 2012, edited 1 time in total.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
deeps wrote:It really makes sense as I read in one of the articles that affliction to 11th house or lord is a must for spiritual advancement. Thanks for explaining it it very clearly. By the way, what does the word "trishadaya" means? I have not been able to find its meaning.
The 3rd, 6th and 11th houses are called trishadaya houses, and they are considered to be evil houses.
"Go thou and follow Him, who was born and gave His life for others five hundred times before He attained the vision of the Buddha!" -- Swami Vivekananda
Re: Is destiny really predestined?...Fate Vs Freewill
by Yellow » Fri Jul 06, 2012 10:57 am
deeps wrote:
but I will still prefer to call it God's help than to say it is my destiny.
well, what is the difference between God and destiny. After all, God is the controller of everything in the universe.
Aseem,
The difference between God and destiny is, God is the controller, destiny is the instrument of control.
Aseem? Yellow deeps is actually Aseem? I tht his DOB was same as astroboy - 26th April, 1973, born early morning. Same lagna and same placements of planets. NO?
I agree with you that the 7th lord is very badly afflicted in the chart, and shows difficulty in regard to marriage. Venus in the 7th house is not a good placement, but an affliction, if you ask me. It falls under the Karaka Bhava Nasha principle, which states that when a planet sits in a house, which signifies the same thing as the planet does, it harms those significations in the person's life. For example Venus in 7th house will give problems in regard to marriage, Jupiter in the 5th house will give problems in regard to children, Moon in the 4th house will give problems to mother, Mars in the 3rd house will give problems to siblings etc.
I have seen the horoscope of a person who has venus in 7th, i have known him since 25 years. He was very much attached to his mother and did not even want to get married but then he got married and then started even distancing from his mother. He has been very fond of his wife and there bas been no problem in his relationship with his wife and he says there is more than 100% frequency match between them. In fact he praises his mother in law and says his mother is stupid. In fact he is a religious person, doing regular yoga, decent and so on. His lagna is vrishchik and has venus in 7th and he recalls his venus dasa was the best period in his life so far. He is an elderly person, retired, and has seen most dasas.
Also I have a relative with guru in 5th and has a son who is very fond of his mom and is very religious and is having neecha guru but he writes excellent articles on vaishnavism.
May be I dont know if these are exceptions.
Now, let us for a change come to astrology, which is the science of the study of the planets, and their effect on our lives. Does astrology have a say in regard to our thinking, in regard to the efforts we put in life? Yes, it does! Mercury rules our intelligence in astrology, and Moon rules our mind, and 4th and 5th house in a birth chart rules our mind and intellect respectively. Now, coming to efforts, Mars signifies that and so does the 3rd house. What do we infer from this? It’s very simple that the thoughts that come to our mind, the efforts that we put in life are not in our hands because it’s in the hands of the planets that control our lives, which proves for us that the so called free will is actually the will of the planets.
Now, let us talk about astrology. If we read the books on astrology, both the classics and also the books written by modern authors based on what the classics have said, or if we read the articles on astrology written by the modern astrologers, do we ever come across the word “free will” or any synonym of that in their writing?
Take the example of the astrological classic, "Brihat Parashara Hora Shastra", which is considered to be the bible of astrology: we find numerous planetary combinations stated there, giving different effects. We read about the different dashas, and the various effects they give. Do we even a single time get to read anywhere that the planetary combinations will give result only if efforts are put by the person, that is, the result of the planetary combinations, the results of the planetary dashas are subject to the person putting efforts? If we see all the astrology books that are available in the market, I don’t think we will find a single one in which it is stated that the effect of the planets will be felt only if the person puts his own efforts—otherwise not.
Very well said and again brilliantly written by you!! Hats off to you!!!
I also wrote something on Katie Holme's thread which I am pasting here again-
Yes, the person was right that the amount of freewill a person has is determined by the placements of planets. A strong 3rd house of self efforts or Mars will always make a native believe in much freewill than a native with a weak 3rd house or Mars. If everyone has equal amount of freewill, then everyone will become Tom crusie or Katie Holmes. But in practicality, it will never happen, never happen. A person with a strong 3rd house but with very weak dhan yogas, will always struggle to make wealth of long lasting, even using 100% freewill.
Set aside astrology, and see for yourself that it is rich people that always have more choices.
