The Navamsha - A introspection

[thirthachengappa]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 3:31 pm
This chart does not help provide a conclusive evidence, because on it's own this is a very good chart from career and wealth perspectives:
--the Dhanesh and Labhesh i.e 2nd and 11th Lords is exalted Mercury and in gopuramsa in dasavarga charts

This topic is about Navamsha and its importance. The very same Mercury is debilitated in the D9.What about that? Now the matter is that Budha is debilitated in the D9 but by your own logic Budha gave the person great results. How is that possible?

[shilpa]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 3:31 pm
This chart does not help provide a conclusive evidence, because on it's own this is a very good chart from career and wealth perspectives:
--the Dhanesh and Labhesh i.e 2nd and 11th Lords is exalted Mercury and in gopuramsa in dasavarga charts

This topic is about Navamsha and its importance. The very same Mercury is debilitated in the D9.What about that? Now the matter is that Budha is debilitated in the D9 but by your own logic Budha gave the person great results. How is that possible?

Hello tirtha,

I have made my comment in response to astroboy pointing this chart's wealth and career success and attributing it to Pushkarnavamsa. His word's refrencing this to Pushkar have been quoted in my text.
I would wait to see his response.

Re: your comment on Me debilitation in D9.....I happy to answer it outside in another forum.....don't want to spoil astroboy's thread by digressing it.

regards

regards

[astroboy]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 3:31 pm
Pushkarnavamsa is a very, very interesting topic, difficult one to treat......currently falling somewhere between the realms of larget than life myths and realities.

Shilpa ji, good day,

Jyotish is all about myths and realities. Pushkara and how those degrees came to be, is myth. It is also reality today.

Did Chandra really have a rocking time with Guru's wife Tara? Was budha born out of that rocking time?

Was Shani born to Chaaya? Why did Shani hate Kuja? Why is Shukra best friends with Shani? why does Kuja hate Budha? Why does Chandra have a problem with Budha?

Myths and Jyotishya are a part of life. Both go hand in hand. If you ask me how can the positions of the 9 planets, at the time of birth of a individual make or break a human's life. I have no answer. Yet we believe. And that belief becomes reality.

Ramanan ji, Komilla Sutton ji, have explained beautifully how Pushkara works. I request you to please go through this entire thread, and not just this horoscope. There are cases I have quoted and explained in the previous thread. Please go through them when you have the time.

Thanks and best regard's
Deepak,

[astroboy]

Shilpa Ji, I am happy you have tackled Budha in this chart, But you have not explained how a debilitated planet in the D9 came about to give good results. I still hold a planet in the Navamsha in debilitation is debilitated. But what about Shani. Shani is in the 9th house in debilitation. Please note that both Shani and Kuja are in Pushkaramshas. How has Shani delivered excellent results?

[astroboy]

Dear all,
please note, The result of a planet is the cumulative effect it has on itself. That effect is shown on us. planets in Pushkaramsha has to, and will give good results.

[shilpa]

Shilpa Ji, I am happy you have tackled Budha in this chart, But you have not explained how a debilitated planet in the D9 came about to give good results.

you never asked that question

I still hold a planet in the Navamsha in debilitation is debilitated. But what about Shani. Shani is in the 9th house in debilitation. Please note that both Shani and Kuja are in Pushkaramshas. How has Shani delivered excellent results?

I don't think from the extent to which you have narrated the case there is any explanation that shani has given him good results.
Has shani given him good results ?

[thirthachengappa]

D3, I think she has not gone through the thread completely. How will she explain Amitabh's debilitated Shukra giving excellent results as the 4th and the 10th lord?

[astroboy]

This is a chart of Sonali Shah, a member of this forum. Please see this chart and you will realise how Pushkara works,

Female
Oct 29th 1980,
19 : 50
Bombay

Guru is in Pushkaraamsha. Guru is the 8th and the 11th lord in the 5th. Guru as the karaka for the 2nd, 5th, 9th, 10th and 11th gave the person everything his significations promised.

Guru is in a Nakshatra whose lord is in Debilitation. He should have given nothing. yet Guru gave her the world. She is in the US, is a engineer, Married, has a Kid, and is doing extremely well financially.what more can you ask from Guru ?please note, The result of a planet is the cumulative effect it has on itself. That effect is shown on us. planets in Pushkaramsha has to, and will give good results.

[astroboy]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:07 pm

astroboy wrote:
Shilpa Ji, I am happy you have tackled Budha in this chart, But you have not explained how a debilitated planet in the D9 came about to give good results.

you never asked that question

I still hold a planet in the Navamsha in debilitation is debilitated. But what about Shani. Shani is in the 9th house in debilitation. Please note that both Shani and Kuja are in Pushkaramshas. How has Shani delivered excellent results?

I don't think from the extent to which you have narrated the case there is any explanation that shani has given him good results.
Has shani given him good results ?

at the onset I mentioned that he is happily married and is lucky(6th and the 7th in the 9th). Shilpa ji, Shani is the 7th lord and is debilitated. more than 12 years of marriage. Shani as the 6th, a important Upachaya house, and as the 7th lord should have given trouble in married life. Yet the marriage is stable. More importantly, Shani as a debilitated 6th lord in the 9th should have destroyed all the 9th house significations. However that is not the case. Look at Kuja the dispositor. Kuja is again in Pushkaraamsha. This has boosted the 9th house significations a great deal.

[thirthachengappa]

Shilpa going by your earlier logic, is Budha not combust because he is placed in the same rashi as ravi? how can Budha give good results?

This is for the 8th oct, 1970 chart.

Regards

[astroboy]

Gandhi, Mohandas
Birthname Gandhi, Mohandas Karamchand
born on 2 October 1869 at 07:11:48 (= 07:11:48 AM )
Place Porbandar, India, 21n38, 69e36
Timezone LMT m69e36 (is local mean time)
Rodden Rating A
Some sources say it is 7 20.

What is extraordinary about this chart? Take a close look at the Lagna lord. Shukra is in his Pushkaranavamsha and is placed well in the D9 due to this. I dont need to say more.

[shilpa]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:07 pm

astroboy wrote:
Shilpa Ji, I am happy you have tackled Budha in this chart, But you have not explained how a debilitated planet in the D9 came about to give good results.

you never asked that question

I still hold a planet in the Navamsha in debilitation is debilitated. But what about Shani. Shani is in the 9th house in debilitation. Please note that both Shani and Kuja are in Pushkaramshas. How has Shani delivered excellent results?

I don't think from the extent to which you have narrated the case there is any explanation that shani has given him good results.
Has shani given him good results ?

at the onset I mentioned that he is happily married and is lucky(6th and the 7th in the 9th). Shilpa ji, Shani is the 7th lord and is debilitated. more than 12 years of marriage. Shani as the 6th, a important Upachaya house, and as the 7th lord should have given trouble in married life. Yet the marriage is stable. More importantly, Shani as a debilitated 6th lord in the 9th should have destroyed all the 9th house significations. However that is not the case. Look at Kuja the dispositor. Kuja is again in Pushkaraamsha. This has boosted the 9th house significations a great deal.

Hello astroboy,

1) thanks for more details on the 1970 born Manglorean native......the entire focus in your initial post was on his 700 employees, wealth, real estate, multimillion USD etc.

yes shani is bad for him in Rasi and owning the house of marriage...but the Karak for Marriage Venus is very strong in rasi and in good amasabal in dasa varga charts.....so the Rasi negatitvity of of house of marriage is compensated for to a big extent...by the strength of Karak of marriage in rasi and dasavarga.

Further shani is in a friendly house placement in D9 and a good amsabala in dasavarga....compenstaing to some extent the debility in rasi.

so his good married life cannot be necessarily delineated to Pushkar Navamsa.

2) The chart of Sonali like-wise has many strengths using conventional analysis...such as 7th lord common with 12th and in Swkashetra ( i.e own house)....and the planet that is in highest amsabala in dasavarga. That alone is sufficient to give a good married life in foreign lands.
Further Jup is in MT in D9 and also the planet with highes amsabala in dasavarga along with L7/ L12 of Rasi.

3) The point here is that the examples charts put forward are good / strong on their own.....then it becomes difficult to delineate and attribute their successes to the placements of planets in the pushkara bhaag of a rasi.

the only conclusive way will be to find a set of rather average/ poor chart that does not promise much throuhg normal / convetional analysis...yet the native has risen significantly.

I appreciate your hard effort and very informative materials...on this subject...and I am sure our readers will also appreciate the need for above in italics for more conclusive delineation of the affects of Pushkara bhag placement of planets.

Wish you a good Day---S

[astroboy]

Strauss-Kahn, Dominique
born on 25 April 1949 at 11:10 (= 11:10 AM )
Place Neuilly-sur-Seine, France, 48n53, 2e16
Timezone MET h1e (is standard time)
Rodden Rating AA
Chandra, Guru and the Ascendent in Pushkaraamsha. Guru the 9th lord, (crucial planet in any ones chart) is debilitated, but is in Pushkaraamsha. I rest my case.

[astroboy]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:05 pm
1) thanks for more details on the 1970 born Manglorean native......the entire focus in your initial post was on his 700 employees, wealth, real estate, multimillion USD etc.

You have not explained how a combust (By your theory) and debiliated Budha in the Navamsha as the 2nd and the 11th lord in the Rashi has given this man all this wealth and power.

appreciate your hard effort and very informative materials...on this subject...and I am sure our readers will also appreciate the need for above in italics for more conclusive delineation of the affects of Pushkara bhag placement of planets.

On another note I must thank you for the words of support. Sarcastic no doubt, because if you have read what i have written from the beginning, you would not be saying what I put in quotes below, But I dont expect anything else from you.

the only conclusive way will be to find a set of rather average/ poor chart that does not promise much throuhg normal / convetional analysis...yet the native has risen significantly.

There are 4 charts in this thread where people have risen from ordinary lives to make it big. All Factors are cumulative in Jyotishya Shilpa ji. Just because I am writing here about Pushkaramsha does not mean that the other factors are redundant or are not at work.

On this thread, I am just explaining that this is one of the contributing factors to a human's success.

Kindly go through every post on this thread, and then you will understand yourself.

What was Gandhi ji? What was Barack and what was Amitabh before they made it big? I leave it to you; you can buy the concept of Pushkara, or trash it. That is your choice. There is irrefutable proof that it works. I leave it to you, to either buy it or leave it. If you just free your mind, the rest will follow

[astroboy]

Strauss-Kahn, Dominique
born on 25 April 1949 at 11:10 (= 11:10 AM )
Place Neuilly-sur-Seine, France, 48n53, 2e16
Timezone MET h1e (is standard time)
Rodden Rating AA

Comming back to Strauss Kahn,Chandra,(Lagna lord in the 9th) Guru ( the 9th lord)and the Ascendent are in Pushkaraamsha. Guru the 9th lord, (crucial planet in any ones chart) is debilitated, but is in Pushkaraamsha.

Published: Saturday, Aug 27, 2011, 17:38 IST | Updated: Saturday, Aug 27, 2011, 19:39 IST
Place: NEW YORK | Agency: Reuters A New York judge dropped all criminal sexual assault charges against ex-IMF chief Dominique Strauss-Kahn on Tuesday after prosecutors lost faith in the credibility of his accuser.
New York State Supreme Court Justice Michael Obus accepted the prosecutors' request for dismissal of all charges. The move left the man once seen as the leading contender to be the next president of France close to freedom and the chance to try to rebuild his tarnished political career.

Lucky dont you think? Chose the right woman to play around with

[thirthachengappa]

AB, until people understand that a planet works based on the collective influences on it and concepts like pushkara amsha are just other factors which add to the strength of a planet, there is no point in writing about any esoteric concepts. Don't try to substantiate your stand. Open minded people who want to learn, accept and apply these concepts will do so whether you like it or not.

This is the same thing as saying what weightage should be given to nakshatras, divisional charts etc and finally using the same concepts to analyse the charts later. I asked you to write about the Navamsha and provided you with my inputs as well because in my experience the Navamsha is a very very important division chart. One should first learn how to use D9 before getting into D10, D20 and D24.

Keep going.

[shilpa]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:05 pm
1) thanks for more details on the 1970 born Manglorean native......the entire focus in your initial post was on his 700 employees, wealth, real estate, multimillion USD etc.

You have not explained how a combust (By your theory) and debiliated Budha in the Navamsha as the 2nd and the 11th lord in the Rashi has given this man all this wealth and power.

Hello astroboy,

Navamsa is the chart for happiness, mental peace-satisfaction, creativity talents type of abstract things.
While the physical/ material gains are signified by Rasi overall.... and Dasmasa for career specifically.
So debilitation in the 5th house of navamsa will impact the mental satsifaction and happiness side of things.....and not the phsyical / material aspects.

Me is exalted in Rasi and with the highest amsa in dasavarga.....outside the combustible degrees. ...and contributes strongly to the material wealth gains...but not the only factor.
And the chart as stated earlier...is not about Me alone.....strong Venus in Rasi and Dasavarga, friendly Mars+Sun in Rasi and strong Jup in Dasamsa and dasavarga are contributing to the material successes of the native.

What we really need are some chart that is average/ weak/ poor on their own.

regards

[thirthachengappa]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:14 pm

outside the combustible degrees

Finally

[astroboy]

by shilpa » Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:14 pm
Hello astroboy,
Navamsa is the chart for happiness, mental peace-satisfaction, creativity talents type of abstract things.
While the physical/ material gains are signified by Rasi overall....

Back to square one. The whole idea of writing this thread was to highlight the school of thought that the Navamsha is equal to the Rashi chart and all matters can be read from it.

Brihat Jataka chapter 2 Shloka 19
Any planet when stationed in its exalted house, or in its friend's house, or in its Moola-Trikona house, or in its Navamsha or in its own sign becomes powerful by virtue of its position or location (Sthanabala).

By making the above statement, Brihat Jataka put the Navamsha on the same pedestal as the Rashi chart.


http://www.lightonvedicastrology.com/ph ... 42&t=11943 Reason why the Navamsha is important.

I have seen the strength of the chart as a whole. My point of quoting it as a example was to highlight what Budha, Shani and Kuja have done for this chart. In specific Budha, due to his debilitation in the Navamsha. I maintain that though Budha is debiliated in the Navamsha, the Pushkara Amsha gave it strength to do good.

[astroboy]

I think this should help you understand why I am writing this topic Shilpa ji,

Brihat Jataka chapter 8 sloka 7. The planet situated in the exalted portion, Moola-Trikona, own house, or ally's house, if found to occupy the detrimental Navamsha or the enemy's Navamsha will yield in his Dasha or Antardasha period mixed results, e.g., will give wealth but at the same time will inflict diseases. Similarly if the planet be situated in any enemy's house or in the house of detriment, and also occupies the exalted Navamshas or ally's Navamshas or his own Navamshas then, too, mixed results will be awarded. The results will be highly auspicious, inauspicious, mixed, and worst according to their designations respectively. Now will be stated in their proper order the Dasha and the Antardasha results.

[astroboy]

Wealth from the Navamsha,

Brihat Jataka Chapter 19 Sloka 5 When the Moon during birth occupy the Mars' Navamsha in the corresponding Mesha or Vrischika portions and when She is aspected by Venus, the individual born will become a wealthy man.

[astroboy]

Profession from the Navamsha

Brihat Jataka Chapter 19 Sloka 5. When the Moon during birth occupy the Mars' Navamsha in the corresponding Mesha or Vrischika portions and when She is aspected by the Sun, the individual born will become a city magistrate or kotwal.

[astroboy]

Brithat Jataka chapter 8 sloka 5. The Dasha and the Antardasha of the strongest planet when exalted and in its exalted degrees is termed Sampurna. The Dasha of the weak planet when debilitated and in detrimental degrees is termed Rikta. The Dasha of the planet when in its enemy's Navamsha and also in its debilitated house and in detrimental degrees is termed Anishta.

[shilpa]

^ Dear astroboy,
thank you for the explanations above. There is a LOT written in classics....that is why validation and delineation is required.
I do appreciate the hardwork you have put in researching this subject and it is with sincerity and no sarcasms.

Both persepctives are in front of the readers...and maybe they find yours most convincing.
At the very least an alternative perspective would make the readers look out validation on wider crossection of charts that they have access to, that we might not have.

@ tirtha...even thouhg off-topic...I am glad you smiled.

regards

[thirthachengappa]

@ Shilpa - I am glad you think there could be two perspectives