Maandi / Mandi / Gulika

[parijataka]

@Crystalpages ji, people in Tamil Nadu and to some extent in Kerala have problem pronouncing vowels pa/pha/ba/bha , ta,tha, da, dha, etc. For example the name Senthil cold be pronounced `sentil`, `senthil`, `sendil` or `sendhil` ! Similarly `phaladeepika` could morph to `baladeebiga`.

[Dev]

you are wrong parijataka Brahmins speak sanskritised tamil and can pronounce exactly.

[Crystalpages]

Thanks Parijataka ji! I was worried that Mantreswar ji wrote a companion volume that we northeners were not aware and missed out on. Kerala Astros indicated at several points that many kerala gems remained untranslated and therefore in local custody only

[subramanianp]

@Crystalpages ji, people in Tamil Nadu and to some extent in Kerala have problem pronouncing vowels pa/pha/ba/bha , ta,tha, da, dha, etc. For example the name Senthil cold be pronounced `sentil`, `senthil`, `sendil` or `sendhil` ! Similarly `phaladeepika` could morph to `baladeebiga`.

Malayalam is so close to sanskrit and KERALA is better known for correct pronounciation of SANSKRIT .

[parijataka]

@subramanianp and @Dev - agree ! Apparently Tamil has something called `grantha lipi` in which all the alphabets are written and pronounced correctly vs modern Tamil which allows leeway in pronunciation and Malayalam has in my opinion the best Sanskrit pronunciation in India ! Having said that in normal day to day conversation Tamils and Malayalis do mispronounce some words.

[Dev]

Ok, better comments.

[radiance]

Wonderful thread, especially below comment on 2nd page..Couldn't really read beyond 3rd page. Commenting just to get this wonderful topic back in attention. Being from Kerala, I have at least heard of maandi and there's quite a lot discussed here. It is interesting that be it the west, east or south of India, each side has its unique style of jyotish and making predictions and each accurate in their own way.

Sir , You will not believe me , I have seen astrologers start a Dasha from Maandi in a Prashna . I thought the Tantri had lost his mind , But he did start the dasha from Maandi . I did not have the courage to ask him what the logic behind it was, But he went on rattling Sanskrit slokas and the rest of other Tantri's just kept Nodding .

[Vivek Surya]

नमः शिवाय!

Malayalam is so close to Sanskrit and KERALA is better known for correct pronunciation of SANSKRIT .

How much close it is? You feel it's close, but it's not, this should judged by the people who knows both संस्कृतम् & Malayalam! Yes Kerala is better known for wrong pronunciation of संस्कृतम्! because we are borrowed lot of words from Tamizh! & we're the one who mispronounce lot of words!
Even lot of people claims so & so, but what I've observed is people are taking the pride of it, that's it & nothing else!

This is as per Chapter 25,sloka14 of BHALADEEPIKA.

See here itself, is it not mispronouncing a book name?
It is फलदीपिक (Phaladeepika) It's not bha or fa it's pha

[Dev]

Radiance:
You are from Kerala where mandi is considered important. But there are many who predict without taking mandi into account. Then why should mandi be considered so important, can we not have complete predictions without taking mandi into account? What additional information we get?
In fact some do not even consider rahu and ketu, and treat their dasas as equivalent or more powerful than the dasa of the lord wherein they are placed.

[radiance]

Exactly. Which is why I mentioned each direction in India has its own way of predicting and each correct in its own. Intention was not to highlight own state or techniques therein. Example : Bengal is a powerhouse in itself on astrology. We know of instances of Ramakrishna Paramahansa and Vivekananda checking almanacs/their astrological knowledge etc. There was a wonderful telefilm called Jyotishi aired in doordarshan many years back directed by Dipankar de on the subject- as hard as I tried to get it online I am not able be see it anywhere. Rajya sabha tv did an interview with Jackie Shroff where he said his father who was an astrologer used to go to Bengal regularly to get Jyotish lessons. His father had foretold that Jackie would make it big in media and also knew that Jackies elder brother would not live long (He died in front of Jackie when he was barely ten and his father had discouraged him from going out into the sea that day).. It's unlikely they used maandi then... and by the way Jackies astrologer father was friends with Dhirubhai Ambani and predicted his meteoric rise before he made it big. This is the power of Eastern Indian astrology..

Coming to the west, Gujarat and surrounding states also has its fare share of excellent astrologers particularly naadi jyotish which I believe is not the same as nadi jyotish practised in southern states Tamil nadu and Kerala etc. Towards the north, Delhi(where I was brought up) and other areas are probably influenced by both eastern and western indian astrology methods. I am not sure if they have any other primary approach(as there could be several different approaches to astrology as well with/without maandi rahu/ketu etc).

This original thread on Maandi, however, is interesting. I am a bit biased to astroboy's posts I would admit - they are really well written with crisp english, no typing mistakes and detailed info on the subject. That fact apart, he is from Mangalore/Goa side and he is writing about maandi here practised in Kerala(which by the way is famous for ashtamangala prashnam as well).

Also on Vivek's question- I had Sanskrit in school for 2-3 years and can read/write Malayalam as well and no, I do not think Malayalam is any closer to Sanskrit than Tamil or Hindi. Each Indian language possibly has a few words borrowed or sounding similar to Sanskrit which is not surprising considering it is a very old language. In writing it does look like Hindi(Devanagri Script) so those who can read hindi can easily read sanskrit without understanding a word of it. Even German, they say, has words similar to Sanskrit. So that becomes a longer topic to discuss.

=> Jackie's interview (talks about his astrologer father from 10 minutes although the full interview is worth a watch) - https://youtu.be/Ef3zTBkrXI4?t=10m2s One can also see how awesome a person this guy is. Likes of salman khan and others wouldn't even look like pennies compared to this gem of a person, his love, compassion and universal beliefs.

[Dev]

well said.
Very interesting to know of Jackie, I will watch, comment.

[radiance]

In the same video he talks about how certain plants such as Areca nut give out oxygen in the night as well. This was news to my ears and later found out that there are 10-15 plant species such as Tulsi, Peepal, Snake plant(commonly used for decoration purposes) that have the ability to give out oxygen 24 hours a day.

Another video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48hu1G-zOTo - Between 9 and 13 minutes related to his father & brother. His brother went to the sea against the warning from his father and drowned while trying to save a kid from neighbour. Neighbour survived and his brother died. Amazing. Simply amazing. I find this somewhat similar to the serial I talked about. Perhaps someone who reads this post has the video with them.

http://www.gomolo.com/jyotishi-movie-sy ... tory/13538

[Dev]

TQ for the information.

[Vivek Surya]

नमः शिवाय!
I was just about to sleep, but before shutting down the PC, I just opened JHora & saw Mr GK & Mr Maandi in my chart. Every time I see them, I'd feel sad by looking their position in my horoscope! & was just thinking It'd be better if I was born after 15 minutes to the actual time of my birth now I've just changed the time, Mr GK & Mr Maandi has shifted from Leo / Virgo to Taurus. I was like, What's happening?! just within a minute Mr GK & Mr Maandi has shifted from Leo / Virgo to Taurus. Then I trying to found is there any changes in the chart in regards to strength of a Graha. The constellation in which respected Mr GK & Mr Mandi are posited their Shadbala has drastically fallen! I was quite aware of the Shadbala, Ishta phala & Kashta Phala calculations. It's from the following website https://www.dirah.nl/shadbala.htm that I've acquired mostly!
I'm glad if they've actually considered the constellations where Mr GK & Mr Maandi are posited. But seemingly they didn't, in a layman's view.
Now, what I want to convey is, Mr GK & Mr Maandi causes the ill effects of the respected constellation's Lord.
For example: Supposing Mr GK & Mr Maandi if posited in Constellation Punarvasu & Pushyami, their respective Lords i.e., Jupiter's & Saturn's Shadbala will reduce drastically compared with its previous value w.r.t (read as with respect to or read as with reference to) a constant Ascendant.

Now, my doubt is Raahu & Ketu doesn't have any Shadbala! So, what if Mr GK & Mr Maandi is posited in Swati or Makha or Ashwini or Shatabhishak. What happens & what're we suppose to conclude?!

There's a lot of benefits one can learn from malefic Grahaas like Shani, Raahu-Ketu, Mars & also with a Kroora Graha Sun. What one will learn from Mr GK & Mr Maandi? May learned persons guide us!

I think Mr GK & Mr Maandi are highly malefic upa Grahaas which are misfortunes in maximum horoscopes! Comments are highly appreciated since above points are just my opinion & they're susceptible to change if comments are reasonable & if It's involved with logic!
Thanks

[Dev]

When rahu and ketu are chaya grahas and their periods are counted in dashas and antardashas,still some opine that they behave like the planet of the house they sit in and do not act independently though in fact they are considered to give even stronger effects than the planet they represent. Shadbala and astavarga values are not considered for rahu and ketu. When it is so, when being counted among the 9 planets, when some astrologers do not consider rahu and ketu for predictions, then where is the question of gulika and maandi being considered?

[subramanianp]

I have not read anywhere ,Gulika affecting the SHADBALA of a planet.

[Dev]

yes that is what I wrote

[Vivek Surya]

नमः शिवाय!

I have not read anywhere ,Gulika affecting the SHADBALA of a planet.

yes that is what I wrote

Subrahmaniam P Ji & Dev avargal randomly open JHora in your P.C. Observe clearly where Mr Gk & Mr Maandi are & then see It's constellation & Its constellation's ruler's Shadbala after your observation, now change the time till Mr Gk & Mr Maandi shifts to another constellation, now observe its Shadbala (Kindly fix the Ascendant & don't change it, If Mr Gk & Mr Maandi aren't changing in one constant Ascendant change the Ascendant & repeat the process as above, now you'd definitely see the Shadbala variation of the Graha with Its previous value) I'm not justified Mathematically why does it change because I'm not aware with the formula used! I've just conveyed what I've observed, that's it.

Subrahmaniam Ji, Mr Gk & Mr Maandi are in 9th house & 10th house respectively in my horoscope. My 9th lord Sun is in Sagittarius Ascendant. Sun's Shadbala is 130 in terms of % strength with 6.49 in Rupaas at my time of birth, after few minutes later i.e., at 6:49 A.M. Mr Gk & Mr Maandi are shifted to my 6th house & are in Mrigashira Nakshatram. So, now Mars Shadbala was gradually reduced from 152 to 112 in terms of % strength. In rupass it reduced by 2 units i.e., from 7.61 to 5.61. Sun's Shadbala has changed from 129 to 165 (in terms of % strength) 6.49 to 8.45 in rupaas

Shadbala and astavarga values are not considered for rahu and ketu. When it is so, when being counted among the 9 planets, when some astrologers do not consider rahu and ketu for predictions, then where is the question of gulika and maandi being considered?

Yes Dev avargal! Some doesn't & some may. If we need precise predictions or like if we're researching it I think one will see Graha avastha also. Is it in direct or stationary & so on by relative speeds values. It depends on one's special interest

[Dev]

Vivek:
May be some use, but if astroexperts can make reasonably good predictions without incorporating mandi and gulika, I think that would suffice, why complicate further when already we have so many parameters under consideration. So this is my view. You can have yours.

[element5]

Both Mandi and Gulikan are extensively used in Prashna. Shrimaan P.S Iyyer Sahib and Shri.M.R Bhatt have explained their usage. Gurudev Shri.N.E Muthuswami wrote a whole book on the subject. To understand Gulikan and Mandi one has to understand the story of Shani and his birth. Shani has a brother. The word "Jammakola" has special significance which is used by traditional astrologers in remote Tamil Naidu. I do not know whether they understand the real meaning and derivation of the word but its meaning explains why these two positions of a upgraha are different. One is relevant in prashna and another is relevant only in Jatahkam. Sarvarth Chintamani (The original rendering , old one) has some great secrets regarding Gulikan. It is used in time correction in prashna and the lagna can be easily corrected if one knows the position of Gulikan in prashna chart. Several ancestoral badhas, devik prakopas, rare secrets, lagnas of progeny etc are all related to position of this planet. We particularly place it first in Pattam (The traditional wooden board with chakra) because of its significance.

[Dev]

Vivek Surya:
You talk of shadbala values reduction and so on.
Moon has 8.78 rupas in my case followed by mercury 6.91 venus 5.93 sun 5.59 sat 5.34 mars 4.75 and jupiter 4.19. But mercury alone has higher istaphala than kasta phala.
Can we conclude anything at all?
Moon dasa gave me least happiness. Moon is 9th lord with neecha bhanga highest astavarga of 7 and in the house with astavarga of 46. But moon is also badhaka.
But if shadbala high value and badhaka nature have to be taken into account together, what is the waitage for each. You can easily manipulate then. If a person says he had a good period you can say, well he is anyway the 9th lord. If a person says it was very difficult period, then you can say well he is anyway a badhaka. But you should be able to say before the dasa starts as to which aspect of moon would be dominant.