Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by GNE » 04 Apr 2013

ha, true. Don't worry no offense takin amitns.

I was just initially surprised that my lagna and all planets changed in the bhava chalit chart that I got from a website.



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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by subramanianp » 04 Apr 2013

You need to read the book written by Shri B V Raman ,"GRAHA AND BHAVA BALAS'
सर्वे भवन्तु सुखिनः।
सर्वे सन्तु निरामयाः।

Astrologically yours.
Subramanian Pandath.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by sathya prakash » 05 Apr 2013

subramanianp wrote:Dear sathya prakash
You have asked a genuine doubt.
Situations like this only makes people to keep aside the BHAVA concept.
But it is not good.
I will try to answer your question.It is little complex.i don't know how much you will understand.
Look at the 1st sloka of Chapter 8 of Bhala deepika.
It gives you the BHAVASRAYA BHALA of Sun.
Statrting from "Lagne arko alpa kachaha --------------
-----------------shooro,akshamo,nirghrinaha "

you can attribute to the Sun in this chart.
But in the later part of the sloka you can find "simhe nishandhaha puman".
Dot attribute this quality to the sun,because this condition satisfies only if Lagna is Leo and the sun in also in Leo.
Nishandhaha means night blindness.If you predict the native will suffer from 'night blindness'
then you will go wrong.
But all other factors of the sloka can be considered depending upon the shubha drishty,papayoga etc available in the chart.
This is how you have to handle the situation.
Hope you are clear now.
All the best.
Dear Subramaniyan ji,

thanks for your reply.
as you predicted, i didn't understand a bit of it.
but i can ask learned people with respect to my chart.
thanks again for giving me the clues.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by subramanianp » 06 Apr 2013

Dear sathya prakash.
Dont worry.
This is because we depend a lot on books and don't get training under a GURU (Teacher).
There are lot of things a teacher only can feed in to your brain.
Please be in search of a good GURU and get training under him.
All the best.
सर्वे भवन्तु सुखिनः।
सर्वे सन्तु निरामयाः।

Astrologically yours.
Subramanian Pandath.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by vanchithottil » 13 Apr 2013

The difference between rasi chart and bhava chart can be delineated with an example,
Suppose a planet is placed 8th from lagna in rasi chart, but is getting located in 7th bhava in bhava chart,
It will give the result of 7th bhava during the dasa of that planet ,but due to its being 8th from lagna(a dusthana} the result of that dasa will be malefic with relation to that bhava(ie, problem with spouse etc}

Normally yogas ,aspects etc are considered only from Rasi charts and
Divisional charts are used only along with rasi charts (even though different authorities are divided on this issue}
Bhava charts are used only for the correct delineation of bhava results.

One another important factor to be considered while analzing these two charst are the impact of rasi sandhi and bhva sandhi of planets with respect to its bhalas(results}.

Rasi sandhi & Bhava sandhi are totally different.

One rasi normally consists of 30 degree rt, so planets placed in the very beginning & very close of each rasis can be called , placements in rasi sandhis.
(ie normally from 0-1 degree in the beginning & 29-30 degree in the end).When planets are placed in rasi sandhi it becomes very weak to support the house it lords and its houses loose its merits generally.Worst of Rasi sandhi dosha is Gandantha sandhi doshas ie, sandhi between fiery & watery rasis(eg, Pisces- Aries,cancer-Leo etc).So birth in these conjunctional points can be troublesome generally.Simply those planets thats is getting changed from D-1 chart to Bhava chart can be termed as planets placed in rasi sandhi.

Bhava sandhi means while calculating Bhava sputa ,planets are getting placed either in Bhava beginning(arohi), Bhava madhya or towards the end of the bhava(avarohi), so those planets closely placed towards the beginning & end of of the Sputa is called planetary placements in bhava sandhi.Planets in bhava sphutta sandhi is bad and bhava madhya is good ,and if it is on either side, it is known as arohi ( means increasing ) and avarohi ( means decreasing ) . The result is that planets placement effect with regard to that bhava is almost nil.For example, we all know that Sun's placement generally in the Lagna Bhava makes the person Bald and have defective eye sight.However, if Sun is placed quite far from the degree of the Lagna, near the sandhi (around 15 degree away from each side of lagna degree), these effects will not be prominent

With Kind Regards
CA Prasanth

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Crystalpages » 10 Mar 2014

Prasanth ji,

Very nice posting! I liked the way you illustrated with the example of a planet in two bhava/signs!
Regarding the ascending/median/descending segments of a house/rashi, do you use the three types of risings described for different signs?

Thanks!

Rohiniranjan

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Crystalpages » 10 Mar 2014

Dear F2F,

Much of Jyotish, presumably originally (wherever and whenever!) arrived was perhaps in the peri-equatorial regions! Where houses and house-holds (?) remained (and still do) traditional...?

Unlike, western tropical which from what we hear originated and in past couple of centuries found its home and succour in northern lats and climes? Wherein, most of the unequalities of houses attracted the practitioners of the craft.

Sadly, divided camps the two have become, divided by zodiacs, techniques and other necessities as observed by me for now three+ decades (if not longer?) and perhaps 2020 shall bring clarity to me, if providence provides!

Near the equator, mostly, as you rightly pointed out, it matters not one whit, whether one uses whole sign, equal houses, Sripati etc, but the further up or down we move away from equator, the perturbation starts.

Being a self-taught afficianado of Jyotish (sans lineage in the usual sense, or GURU etc) I had to rely on my own devices and when suddenly found myself moving from N22 to N52, and finding my love towards jyotish unabated -- I found answers that satisfied me and kept me going...

Love, Light, Reality!

Rohiniranjan

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Dr Neeraj » 20 Mar 2014

Dear Amitns
Subramanian is right. Lagna never chnages in Bhava chart.
I tried Parashar Light and found ur Lagna Cancer 1-48 and all planets except Sat changes in ur Bhava chart.
The position of Jup is gud in Bhava chart as it moves out of its debilitation but not gud for Mars & Ven as they move from their exaltation/own sign.
Anyway Charts are just an indicator; you'll get in life whatever you are due for.
God bless you
Neeraj

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Crystalpages » 20 Mar 2014

Dr Neeraj wrote:Dear Amitns
Subramanian is right. Lagna never chnages in Bhava chart.
I tried Parashar Light and found ur Lagna Cancer 1-48 and all planets except Sat changes in ur Bhava chart.
The position of Jup is gud in Bhava chart as it moves out of its debilitation but not gud for Mars & Ven as they move from their exaltation/own sign.
Anyway Charts are just an indicator; you'll get in life whatever you are due for.
God bless you
Neeraj
Dear Dr. Neeraj,

You did say it so well!

Now a days WE have so many doctors from so many different domains...?

Once any of us arrive at a point where we feel comfortable calling ourselves a doctor, we have become beholden to the simple path of HEALING?

Jyotish is THAT...!

Rohiniranjan
Rohiniranjan

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by huien1 » 20 Mar 2014

Very good illustration Prasanth, to add don't have to consider the house lordship according to rasi as well? In your example, if 5th lord is in 8th in rasi but 7th in bhava then how do we interpret it?

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by lilly2005 » 21 Mar 2014

vanchithottil wrote:The difference between rasi chart and bhava chart can be delineated with an example,
Suppose a planet is placed 8th from lagna in rasi chart, but is getting located in 7th bhava in bhava chart,
It will give the result of 7th bhava during the dasa of that planet ,but due to its being 8th from lagna(a dusthana} the result of that dasa will be malefic with relation to that bhava(ie, problem with spouse etc}

Normally yogas ,aspects etc are considered only from Rasi charts and
Divisional charts are used only along with rasi charts (even though different authorities are divided on this issue}
Bhava charts are used only for the correct delineation of bhava results.

One another important factor to be considered while analzing these two charst are the impact of rasi sandhi and bhva sandhi of planets with respect to its bhalas(results}.

Rasi sandhi & Bhava sandhi are totally different.

One rasi normally consists of 30 degree rt, so planets placed in the very beginning & very close of each rasis can be called , placements in rasi sandhis.
(ie normally from 0-1 degree in the beginning & 29-30 degree in the end).When planets are placed in rasi sandhi it becomes very weak to support the house it lords and its houses loose its merits generally.Worst of Rasi sandhi dosha is Gandantha sandhi doshas ie, sandhi between fiery & watery rasis(eg, Pisces- Aries,cancer-Leo etc).So birth in these conjunctional points can be troublesome generally.Simply those planets thats is getting changed from D-1 chart to Bhava chart can be termed as planets placed in rasi sandhi.

Bhava sandhi means while calculating Bhava sputa ,planets are getting placed either in Bhava beginning(arohi), Bhava madhya or towards the end of the bhava(avarohi), so those planets closely placed towards the beginning & end of of the Sputa is called planetary placements in bhava sandhi.Planets in bhava sphutta sandhi is bad and bhava madhya is good ,and if it is on either side, it is known as arohi ( means increasing ) and avarohi ( means decreasing ) . The result is that planets placement effect with regard to that bhava is almost nil.For example, we all know that Sun's placement generally in the Lagna Bhava makes the person Bald and have defective eye sight.However, if Sun is placed quite far from the degree of the Lagna, near the sandhi (around 15 degree away from each side of lagna degree), these effects will not be prominent

With Kind Regards
CA Prasanth

So true! You have explained it so clearly. A very useful post, Prasanth ji!


Lilly

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by qwert123 » 29 Jun 2015

how to view yogas in bhava chart ?

jagannath hora does not have optin to check yogas in bhava chalit

is there any other free software or online site that displays it ?

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by triphala » 22 Sep 2015

using placidus with lahiri for location of planets, rectifies all incorrect readings. thats also what KP chart is based upon.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Aravind » 15 Oct 2015

Dear Respected Members,

I use Jagannatha Hora but the lagna in Bhava chart changes in case of my sons chart. It doesnt change for most of the others cases. Do you know what is the setting which is causing this issue ?

DOB - Feb/21/2009
Time - 23 : 50
Place - Hackensack , NJ , USA

Thanks
Aravind

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by subramanianp » 17 Oct 2015

The reff for BHAVA chart to be set as Lagna.
To do this Rt click on rasi chart.
A pop up menu comes.
Move cursor to Bhava chakra or chalit chakra option.
Another pop up menu comes.
Look for the last line( choose reference to be made------) and click on that.
In the new pop up select LAGNA.
You did it.
Thats all.
सर्वे भवन्तु सुखिनः।
सर्वे सन्तु निरामयाः।

Astrologically yours.
Subramanian Pandath.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Aravind » 10 Nov 2015

[quote="Dr Neeraj"]Dear AT

Bhav chart is seen for ascertaining whether the rajyogas promised in rashi chart will give full effect of not. Any yoga formed in rashi chart & lost in bhav chart will give only marginal results while those repeatign in bhav chart will give full results.

God bless you
Neeraj[/quote]

Neerajji,

What does your experience indicate yogas involving bhavas are present in bhava chart but not in the rasi chart ? Like in the below chart of a girl,Mars along with Rahu is in the 8th house of Aquarius but in the bhava chart it falls in the 9th house, this now when we look at bhava chart is a strong Raja Yoga involving Rahu along with the 5L/10L in a Trikona. In these cases does this Mars or Rahu give the results of 9th house but show the qualities of aquarius ? Will the Raja Yoga materialize ?

DOB - May/06/2007
Place - Hackensack, NJ, USA
Time - 10 : 45 EST

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Dr Neeraj » 12 Nov 2015

Dear Aravind
In the given chart, except Moon & Ven all other planets change their house in Bhava chart.
So the following results shall be observed:
1. Sun is exalted in 10H of natal chart but in Bhava chart it has moved to 11H hence its results will not be that great.
2. 10L Mars is in 8H with Rahu. This indicates break in career but in Bhava chart since Mars has moved to 9H, the results improve.
3. Jup is in 12H from natal Moon thus making Shakat yoga. But since in Bhava chart Jup has moved to 6H with Moon, this makes Gaj kesari yoga. These results shall be observed in the dasha of Jup.
4. Sat, being 7L/8L is placed in lagna. For Cancer Asc, Sat is a maraka planet. In bhava chart Sat moved to 2H, maraka house, hence it become even more maraka.

So we've to see the yogas and their results in natal chart. If they move to other house in Bhava chart then the results will be modified.

God bless you
Neeraj

tanmish

Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by tanmish » 13 Nov 2015

Hello Dr. Neeraj -

A couple of related questions in re: the above:

1. Predominant results are due to the Rashi chart placements, or Bhava chart, or mix of both?

2. Is 7th lord by definition a Maraka planet? Supposing Venus is 7L for a female, is Venus Marak for her? What if 7L and 12L Venus (Scorpio ASC) is placed in 2H for female chart?

Thanks for your advice, and hope the OP doesn't mind..... :|

TM

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Dr Neeraj » 14 Nov 2015

Dear Tanmish
The two most important things in Astrology are: Yogas and Timing of events

Timing of events is done by dasha and Yogas are seen in natal chart from Lagna, Moon, Sun.
But such yogas must sustain in Bhava chart else they become weak.
This is one of the reason that we expect excellent results from a planet placed in own/mooltrikona house or exalted planets, but such results are either absent or not giving results as expected.
So prominence of combinations is given to natal chart but this must be the same in Bhava chart.

Maraka planets must be understood in different perspective. First there are 8 type of deaths given in classics. Loss of physical body is one type of death. At time excessive diseased condition of body or humiliation is equivalent to death.
From spiritual perspective, going towards materialistic things is also going towards death.
So 7L is more prone to loss of physical body while 8L is more prone to give defamation/humiliation.

Plz note the classics prescribe to first predict the life-span and then rest of the things like marriage, career etc.
Now for Scorpio Asc, Ven is 7L/12L and a qualified maraka. Its placement in 2H in Sagittarius sign make it even more powerful maraka. If Ven dasha is operating at that crucial age span then death may come. In other times, it may give results related to money (2H), fame (7H) and foreign (12H).

God bless you
Neeraj

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Khoo Hock Leong » 14 Nov 2015

Hi Learned Members

From another perspective, anything found in the Bhava Chalit Chart but not the Rasi Chart, nothing is going to materialise. So the Rasi Chart is the anchorpoint although if the same results are obtained in the Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart, the results are going to be significant as what Dr. Neeraj says.

But for prasna, Bhava Chalit Chart is good because this is for answering a query and there is no soul involve. Since Nadi Astrology takes the planetary aspects as soul (the first Nadi Astrology version do not even recognise Bhavas), Nadi aspects are superb for use in Bhava Charts. The Hora Lord would then lead the soul of the rest of the other planets.

So let's say a querist asks something. The astrologer sets up the Bhava Chart then looks at the Hora Lord and the planetary Nadi aspects. So far so good. So how is he going to account for the future transits where the future of the querist may change for a few weeks' time, few months' time, few years' time etc.? He cannot use the planetary transits in the first Bhava Prasna chart erected since the planets are supposed to represent the soul if you use the Nadi aspects.

The querist will have to ask the question again in another Hora Hour. Notice then the planetary positions may change by a miniscule of a degree then (except for the Moon) but the signs all have shifted positions with respect to the Bhavas. The Hora Lord is also different. The fortune of the querist for the same question changes.

Notice such fortune would not change so fast if you are using the Rasi Prasna Chart. In that sense, the Bhava Prasna Chart is good for Prasna.

The assumption is thus we also look at signs in the Bhava Prasna Chart and hence sign rulerships, but they have no souls involved.

Rgds

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Aravind » 14 Nov 2015

[quote="Dr Neeraj"]Dear Aravind
In the given chart, except Moon & Ven all other planets change their house in Bhava chart.
So the following results shall be observed:
1. Sun is exalted in 10H of natal chart but in Bhava chart it has moved to 11H hence its results will not be that great.
2. 10L Mars is in 8H with Rahu. This indicates break in career but in Bhava chart since Mars has moved to 9H, the results improve.
3. Jup is in 12H from natal Moon thus making Shakat yoga. But since in Bhava chart Jup has moved to 6H with Moon, this makes Gaj kesari yoga. These results shall be observed in the dasha of Jup.
4. Sat, being 7L/8L is placed in lagna. For Cancer Asc, Sat is a maraka planet. In bhava chart Sat moved to 2H, maraka house, hence it become even more maraka.

So we've to see the yogas and their results in natal chart. If they move to other house in Bhava chart then the results will be modified.

God bless you
Neeraj[/quote]

Neerajji, Appreciate your analysis. With respect to the same chart when we analyse the chart from Jaimini astrology, the AK Mars which is also the 5L/10L is aspecting the AMK Mercury and PK Sun. This aspect is a Jaimini Raj Yoga. Do we consider bhava charts in Jaimini ? If yes then this Raja Yoga changes to AK Mars aspecting DK Venus in the bhava chart which again is a raj yoga. How do we interpret in such scenarios ? Does it mean the dashas of the Aquarius and Aries where the AK , AMK and PK are placed are going to show a significantly higher positive results ?

DOB - May/6/2007
Time - 10:45 AM , EST
Place - Hackensack, NJ, USA

Iam also posting the same question in the Jaimini section as iam not sure in which section this question needs to go

Thanks
Aravind

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by Dr Neeraj » 15 Nov 2015

Dear Aravind
I've answered your query in Jamini Section.
God bless you
Neeraj

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by qwert123 » 14 Mar 2016

subramanianp wrote:
Astrothurst wrote:Hi,

Please tell me the real impact of Bhava chart and difference between rasi and Bhava chart, In my knowledge Bhava Chart tells the exact placement of the planets. (correct me if am wrong)

.
Dear Astrothurst
I have studied little differently from what Dr neeraj said.
Let me explain that.please see ,I am not opposing Dr neeraj.
Rasi chart is the first chart what we prepare.
For every planet there are laid down results if positioned in each Rasi.
These are given in almost all classics (ie: RASI BHALAM ).
So once the Rasi chart is prepared you get a clear idea about how a planet is going to behave.
Now come to BHAVA chart.(I hope you know how a bhava chart is prepared)
You might have heard that 5th is the PUTHRA STHANA,10th is the KARMA STHANA,8th is the AYUR STHANA etc:
Once you say this please note that PUTHRA STHANA is not the 5th RASI ,but is the 5th BHAVA
Same way AYUR STHANA is not the 8th RASI but is the 8th BHAVA.
Again KARMA STHANA is not the 10th RASI but is the10th BHAVA.

Hope you are clear.
Hello Subramanian ji ,

I have a query regarding this

Let's say if lagna falls at 28 degrees Aries..

Then the first house would be from 13 degree Aries to 13 degree Taurus
2nd house from 13 degree taurus to 13 degree Gemini
3rd - 13 gem to 13 cancer

Who is the second house lord ? The MEP falls on Taurus so definitely venus is strong here ..
But almost 44 % of the house is also ruled by Mercury .. that is a very significant area ..
Does that get ignored completely ?

A planet when rules 2 houses is generally considered to give more effects of the house which is stronger or Mooltrikona , but it also gives results of his second house ownership .. Similarly when a planet has both malefic and benefic tendencies then it is observed that the person gets both good AND bad results instead of ONLY getting results either good OR Bad depending upon which is stronger

So the situation isn't black or white..

Similarly when a house is divided by 2 rulers then shouldn't it also give results of both the rulers ?

Then in the above example shouldn't mercury be considered as a secondary house ruler of 2nd house and also give second house results although to a lesser degree than Venus ?

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by subramanianp » 16 Mar 2016

Dear qwert123
This topic has lot of depth and it is not easy to explain in few words.Still I will try few of your questions.

You said --(Let's say if lagna falls at 28 degrees Aries..
Then the first house would be from 13 degree Aries to 13 degree Taurus
2nd house from 13 degree taurus to 13 degree Gemini
3rd - 13 gem to 13 cancer
)---
You are correct.

You asked :- (Who is the second house lord ? The MEP falls on Taurus so definitely venus is strong here ..
But almost 44 % of the house is also ruled by Mercury .. that is a very significant area ..
Does that get ignored completely ?
)

Ist house lord is Mars,2nd house lord is Venus,3rd house lord is Mercury,4th House lord is Moon,then Sun,then Mercury and so on.As you douted othar parameters get ignored.

You said :- (A planet when rules 2 houses is generally considered to give more effects of the house which is stronger or Mooltrikona , but it also gives results of his second house ownership .. Similarly when a planet has both malefic and benefic tendencies then it is observed that the person gets both good AND bad results instead of ONLY getting results either good OR Bad depending upon which is stronger).----

All these are relevant while assessing the behavior of a planet.For that not only ownership but also placement in KENDRAS,placement in TRIKONAS,placement in UPACHAYAS,placement in DUSTHANAS etc,etc---- are to be seen.These are aplicable to both rasi and bhava charts.

You said :- (Similarly when a house is divided by 2 rulers then shouldn't it also give results of both the rulers ? ).
No.Once your 1st bhava is fixed you should mentally come out of the rasi chart.There are no two rulers.Only one rulership is allotted.

Thanks
सर्वे भवन्तु सुखिनः।
सर्वे सन्तु निरामयाः।

Astrologically yours.
Subramanian Pandath.

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Re: Difference between Rasi Chart and Bhava Chart?

Post by qwert123 » 17 Mar 2016

Thank you sir very much :)

Just 1 last question

Where do you consider planetary aspects like saturn's 3rd and 10th aspect ? In the rashi chart or bhava chart ? ( if they change positions ? )

Thanks

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