Which ayanamsa is true ?

[Racing]

@Rajiv

This is where one's Guru comes in, which is why I always advocate for initiation and instruction from a Guru. S/he will guide you here. In general terms, Chitrapaksha is the way to go.

@GNE

It does matter when planets change signs/houses. I have a cousin who has Rahu in his 3rd if we follow Chitrapaksha and if we compute using Raman, Rahu falls in his 4th house. The significations of Rahu in his 4th house seem to match his life more but when using dashas, Chitrapaksha gives a better picture. So, what are we supposed to do there?

As far as Dr. Raman goes, he didn't use vargas extensively. I've always believed that Dr. Raman had amazing intuition so no matter what ayanamsha he used, it didn't matter.

I do agree with your assessment regarding Shashtiamsa. But in general, just glancing over the free reading section of this forum, I get a sense that we have more sensational predictors here than true astrologers. The amount of people who're keen to predict that so and so won't have a marriage or a child is alarming and truly against the spirit of astrology. And the authority with which some say all these things... You'd think they were God. I come from a school where everything is karma and there is a way to modify karma through daan and dharma.

Regardless, I think Chitrapaksha is the ayanamsha to go for general purposes. Not because it's popular but because it's the default system. For beginners and intermediates, this is a very confusing thing, which is why I believe - unless you're an expert - stick to Chitrpaksha.

[coffeeday]

So , since the ayanamsa issue is the biggest stumbling block in the art of prediction using divisional charts ,for the time being we have to rely on the transits , yogas , dasa& bhukthis only . Divisional charts like shatyamsas have to be left for people who have got high level of intuition , even at the cost being branded as inefficient and ignorant astrologers .

[ChandraLagna]

The amount of people who're keen to predict that so and so won't have a marriage or a child is alarming and truly against the spirit of astrology. And the authority with which some say all these things... You'd think they were God. I come from a school where everything is karma and there is a way to modify karma through daan and dharma.

This is the sanest piece in a long while here and can't agree enough.

[skrajiv]

Some lovely points there Racing.

I have checked mine with Guru and he is asking me to take as per Vakya Panchang. Now Vakya Panchang is not usually supported by any of the softwares and hence am unable to see results at a very concrete level. The Divisional Charts especially go for a complete toss but at least from a Rasi chart perspective it aligns more closely to Raman and hence I prefer to use that. Just for reference, I have 2 planetary changes between Vakya, Lahiri and Raman, I am Mithun Lagna.
Vakya - Mars in 5th and Jupiter in 9th
Lahiri - Mars in 6th and Jupiter in 8th
Raman - Mars in 6th and Jupiter in 9th

Coffee Day,
Due to ayanamsa stumbling issue, even Dasas undergo an issue because of the Domino effect and there are changes in Dasa periods upto 2 years. Hence Dasa & Bhukthi predictions also don't come so easily.

[vedam33]

Which ever ayanamsa we follow the timing of events should match that is most important is my viy

[Crystalpages]

Which ever ayanamsa we follow the timing of events should match that is most important is my viy

But that raises another, perhaps more vexing question, dear fellow-member!

Which method of timing, such as dasas (50+) or transit or other methods of timing, one must consider? This is not a flippant observation or comment, but in parallel/simultaneously, many in the field had been scratching their heads over...? The Cosmic Plot Thickens...?

[vedam33]

See the ayanamsa is also linked with dasas .I am not giving just like that observation .even in jamini system (which is based on rasi ) different school of thought existing .except in vimsothari dasa all were having different school of thoughts .I am again repeating even if one analyse a chart using jamini yogini vimsothari ashtorati kalachakra dasa etc the events should match that depends on ayanamsa only ..so there is no specific ayanamsa .

[vedicmaths]

hello all,

These days astrologers/practitioners unnecessarily attempt to change the birth time,
as though they are doing a big favour to the owner of the chart. Astros fully know well
different ayanamsas will give different dasa/antar periods and yet they attempt a
so called BTR forgetting that they were not to ' seen ' when the child was born. GOD
alone can save astrology.

truly yours,
vedicmaths

[vedam33]

It is true that different ayanamsa will give once in a while for some charts different dasas and antardasa . further the lagna also changes if it is in border .the client is interested in knowing the timing of events and as such which ever ayanamsa we use the timing of events should not change and it should match

[Crystalpages]

hello all,

These days astrologers/practitioners unnecessarily attempt to change the birth time,
as though they are doing a big favour to the owner of the chart. Astros fully know well
different ayanamsas will give different dasa/antar periods and yet they attempt a
so called BTR forgetting that they were not to ' seen ' when the child was born. GOD
alone can save astrology.

truly yours,
vedicmaths

After we mortals give presents and gifts to friends, relatives, CHILDREN and Grand children, do we humans then keep tabs on how those are utilizing what was gifted to them?

I think GOD does not either? The GIFT was downloaded through Parashara, Jaimini, and many Others -- GOD has bigger problems on hand...?

How to fix this climate change thing that children have created and still fighting and denying ownership?
The refugee crises??
The senseless STRIFE that is escalating worldwide???

Can we really think that GOD ALMIGHTY has time to deal with the minority = Astrologers and more locally, Jyotishis and their relatively tiny PROBLEMS...!

[coffeeday]

First of all God is not an entity with all limbs , brain and metabolism . It is cosmic energy which has a very systematic method of ruling the universe . Different portfolios are entrusted to different powers with different names and forms and shapes . Thus veda vidya is entrusted to Jupiter and spiritual field is in the domain of Dakshina murthy as per Hindu religion . Astrology is vedanga .So the person in charge of the subject has all the time in kala . the eternal time .

[Lex]

Now Vakya Panchang is not usually supported by any of the softwares and hence am unable to see results at a very concrete level.

Drig calculations are used sending man-made Satellites to Comet/Star, Planets etc. Vakya calculations, you would find in Almanacs like Pambhu/Tirunelveli Panchangam etc not accurate. Every 100 years or apprx 100 years, entire Solar System goes retrograde ( like Planets Kuja/Guru/Shani/Budha/Shukra), Vakya calculations deter there. Similarly simple Calculations of Rahu Kaal… Vakya calculations are based upon approximation, while Drig supports based upon Latitude /Altitude and Longitude.


Don't rely on Vakya Calculations. It is not consistent. In Finance or in any science based, consistent results seen with a calculation over a period of time, becomes a Gold Standard.


Don't plot horoscope with Astrology Soft-wares, all are Error Proven. Do manual calculations and plot the chart.

[Lex]

After we mortals give presents and gifts to friends, relatives, CHILDREN and Grand children, do we humans then keep tabs on how those are utilizing what was gifted to them?I think GOD does not either? The GIFT was downloaded through Parashara, Jaimini, and many Others -- GOD has bigger problems on hand...?

Can we really think that GOD ALMIGHTY has time to deal with the minority = Astrologers

, Gift taken from Sages, Kalyuga astrologers thinks they are Kaliyug Parashars/ Jaimini. First of all, ask them to plot horoscope manually without software, many of them wll ran away, let alone discuss about Ayanamsa. Ask these Kaliyug Parashars, how Ayanamsa say Lahiri derived, what are the Trignometric formulas involved, many will showa blank face. Kaliyug Jaimini dances on Softwares and even can't analyze is marriage promiseed or progeny blessed, let alone they can't vet birth-time checking through our Sages methods. These are Fundamentals.

Almighty has to fight for his own existence, Ram Lalla temple to be built in Ayodhya in a court case.. Swamy is fighting over in Judiciary, Govt fighting out for the temple since over 7 decades, Almighty is watching..Lord Rama has to come down

Ram Sethu Bridge.. again Swany has to fight out in Court, Lord Rama or Lord Anjaneya hasn't come down but installed confidence in Swamy to fight out. Court has granted only stay ...not to destroy the bridge, future some commie will put another litigation... ( SWamy is over 70 yrs old)... only Lord Rama can save this bridge... fight started by ailing Karuna, who is having Sasa yoga in his chart, long living... he is over 90 yrs old, and an Athesist too. Lord Rama has to fight out through someone in the court for the bridge.

RR ji, in another astrology group, your name cropped up some time back, I don't remember... was Pt Jha ????

[Dr Neeraj]

Dear Lex
With every passing day, you're getting more and more sarcastic.
I wanted to remind you that Humility and Knowledge are best friends.
God bless you
Neeraj

[tylorechandra]

I fully agree with Dr. Neeraj. This sort of caustic comments do no good to anyone.

TKC

[Crystalpages]

...

RR ji, in another astrology group, your name cropped up some time back, I don't remember... was Pt Jha ????

Dear Lex ji,

I have been a member of many astrology-related groups over the past few decades from Compuserve, GEnie, Delphi and several BBS which all were precursors of Internet, and also many groups on Internet after its usage gained popularity primarily due to drastic improvements in the browsers, many of which are now gaining AI at an alarming pace with its mixed blessing.

I have had forum-conversations with Shri Vinay Jha on multiple fora, but don't recall of ever being a member of fora where he was the owner or administrator.

Best wishes!

[majestik108]

I've personally experimented with Traditional Lahiri, Chitrapaksha, Pushyapaksha and SSS.

I'm using SSS right now and I've found that it works best for me. The reason for me initially deciding to really dive into SSS was because it's used for Panchangas by some.

It fits my life quite well.

[murthys68]

dear majestic108, you are not suppose to use the Āyanāmśa just because it is suitable for 1 horoscope. Let's say in my case SSS Āyanāmśa isn't giving the position of nodes correctly. Because there should be a correction which was recommended by sages after a long time.
If you use Citra Paksha it suits. Here we need to understand why we need to take Citra as a Yogatāra. Paksha means opposite here it's supplementary i.e., 180° to Citra constellation. That's where Kāla Puruśa kundali starts. (Aświni Nakṣatram)

By the way I'm pretty clear Mathematically why we need to take Citra as a Yogatāra.

I'll give my horoscope as an example because the nodes are in Vargottama & they got transit just before the month I born. I'm pretty sure that Ketu-Rāhu axis are in 4-10 axis (Pisces-Virgo axis) but not in Aries-Libra axis.
07/01/1996 6:33 am coordinates: 79 E 35, 18 N 00

[murthys68]

I forgot to tell the pratipadārtha of the word Āyanāmśa, Here Āyana means direction, remember the words Uttarāyaṇa, Dakshināyaṇa, like Rāmāyaṇa & so on. Rāmāyaṇa means the direction (or the path here) in which Parandhāma (Rāma) has walked. It teaches us the way he was, isn't so? When I was writing about Rāma my heart has got little melted (crushed which I felt happy) He is supreme!
Amśa meaning component. So, Āyanāmśa meaning the directional component of this Yogatāra Citra. Which points towards the starting of the Kāla Puruśa i.e., should starts from Aświni Nakṣatram.

I've read PVR Ji's PP Āyanāmśa, the article hasn't proved PP Āyanāmśa is correct one. He just gave a Philosophical meaning but that's not satisfactory for Āyanāmśa to be confirmed.
NamaḥShivāya!

[majestik108]

While I am not an expert by any means when it comes to Jyotish, I can say that as of now, SSS has worked for all of the horoscopes I've looked at.

The ayanamsa working for me was simply a hint to myself that I should consider attempting to replicate those results with other horoscopes, and so far, it has delivered.

[murthys68]

I must say you've to check the horoscopes of the people whose Grahās are at the junction i.e., between 2 zodiacs.
& I've already told you that SSS cannot be wrong, however some correction has to be made in that Āyaṇāmśa. Since it is been several years, by every 25,000 years precision of equinoxes differs. Thus, it's crucial & one has to be very very careful in choosing a particular Āyaṇāmśa.
As you've already told that you're a learner, hence you can't be sure, i.e., just with 10 horoscopes! Nah that's why I've told you to check the charts whose Grahās are at the junction & Moreover Astrologers like K. N. Rao, Sunjay Rath Ji recommends to use Citra Pakṣa only.
Well, in my horoscope, if I use SSS, I'll get Mercury in retrograde motion which is absurd! I've a stationary Mercury in which the results I'm experiencing right now! (I'm presently in Mercury Mahādasha) & coming to the nodes that I've already told you!
"I'M PRETTY SURE OF RĀHU ASPECTING VENUS" in my horoscope. Not just on Venus, on Mars & on direct stationary Mercury too! My Ātmakāraka is Venus, So, I'm pretty sure I can feel the results!
Not just that my Kārakāmśa lagna also changes if you use non corrected SSS. I'm sure that I've Sun, Jupiter in 5th house from Kārakāmśa lagna but not 4th from it & I'm sure that Ketu "should be" trines to my Moon.
It's meaningless to me if Rāhu aspecting 3rd house. The entire Rāhu-Ketu axis become meaningless in my horoscope with non corrected SSS
You might feel like SSS is from Lord Surya himself. So, how can that mislead? Your doubt is a valid one, but corrections should be made so as to preserve the concept of precision of equinoxes.

What all I'm thinking is, people could be biased in choosing certain things. Like you may feel that you've Bhadra Mahāpuruśa Yoga, but in reality you've vargottama retrograde Mercury in Cancer in 5th house!

If you want to know about the Precision of equinoxes, you can google it. If you don't understand feel free to ask, I hope you can understand, since there is no much difficulty in it!

[dzonsmit314]

There was an independent test of different ayanamshas, on a variety of reliable birth charts. The best results have been produced by three ayanamshas, all of which are Revati oriented.

[dzonsmit314]

The Chitra Paksha (Lahiri) ayanamsha, which is popular these days, rarely provides the right results. See in "Ayanamsas — A Statistical Study. Buz Overbeck".

A very different ayanamsha is found in Surya Siddhanta (4th-8th centuries CE). In this traditional Indian text, the ayanamsha is based on the Kali-yuga date. According to this, the zodiac begins next to the yogatara Revati (ζ Piscium). This ayanamsha was used by Aryabhata (6th century AD). A similar ayanamsha was used by Bhaskara II (12th century CE). See in "Swiss Ephemeris. 2.8.4. Suryasiddhanta and Aryabhata".
Revati Paksha was the main ayanamsha in Jyotish books published before the 1950s.

Why do we need to use Ayanamsha Lahiri?