Exaltation & Debilitation

[ChandraLagna]

Writing the thread here for discussion, since not everyone has access to the Herrenvolk section

No amount of dictums will be of use unless they are applied in real life situations. I therefore will give you people some real examples of people who have settled abroad, or have connections with foreign lands.
Now let us examine a few horoscopes and see what combinations in their horoscopes helped them move abroad

Male
Oct 5th 1962
5 : 54
Jabalpur (79 E 57 - 23 N 10 )

This person left Indian shores in 1998, settled in Dubai and built his empire there.
Look at the combinations for Foreign residence and a Career there

The 12th lord is in the lagna
The 10th lord is exalted in the lagna ( Giving a great work environment)
The 4th lord is aspected by the 3rd lord
The 9th lord is in the Nakshatra of the 4th and the 7th lord
The 12th lord is associated with the 10th lord In the lagna

[astroboy]

Arun Bhai, Beautiful. Never saw it that way. But when we take debilitation sir ji, we take debilitation / exaltation to be in the whole rashi - Keeping in mind the Avastas.

In the Jabalpur chart, there is a exchange of the 3rd lord and the 11th lord. Note that both are in debilitation ( even if not in the exact degree). kuja the lord of the house where Chandra is, has become powerless. Chandra could have drawn some power if the dispositor was strong. That is not the case.

You can test it with two more horoscopes. 1. Sachin tendulker and 2. My own

[ChandraLagna]

Thank you sir.

Sir, the whole point is Rasi is not to be taken as Deb, its the precise degree, which actually indicates the Nakshatra & its pada which gives the exaltation, and also the debilitation.

I already said sir, your Budha cannot be debilitated. You can never write as well as you do, if your communication Lord is fracked ! Budha is in his OWN nakshatra, the divine Revati !

Let me look also at master blaster chart. Pl do supply more such instances of double-deb charts if you have any. BTW, pl refer to the Madikeri coffee estate boy, born 2009. His Jup is in almost perfect exaltation - 6deg. And we see the results!


Regards,
Arun

[surya]

I would like to offer up my details for discussion: pob - mumbai, tob-22:27, dob- oct 1 1962.

travelled to us in saturn MD (1980's), lots of struggle, but made a new career. Found stable job, got married had kids mid 1990's, bought property end of 1999. Career / life on upswing, until past 2.5yrs when things took a downturn till now.

Regards,
Surya

[astroboy]

by surya » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:50 am
I would like to offer up my details for discussion: pob - mumbai, tob-22:27, dob- oct 1 1962.
travelled to us in saturn MD (1980's), lots of struggle, but made a new career. Found stable job, got married had kids mid 1990's, bought property end of 1999. Career / life on upswing, until past 2.5yrs when things took a downturn till now.

Thank you sir, very nice of you.
7th and the 12th lord in the 3rd in debilitation aspecting the 9th house of long distance travel. Meets the dictum perfectly. 10th lord in the 9th aspecting the 12th lord, gives career abroad.

Down side is due to the setting in of Sadi sati and the antar Dasha of the Moon, being the 3rd in the 6th.Note shani's debilitation in the D9.

Thank you once again.

[Dev]

Hi Arun:
I already said sir, your Budha cannot be debilitated. You can never write as well as you do, if your communication Lord is fracked ! Budha is in his OWN nakshatra, the divine Revati !

Well said, not only budha, but even jupiter. I dont think these two are debilitated in the real sense. He writes very well and has a unique style. Also his sense of humour must be associated with mercury and his sympathy for animals and sathvik qualities must be attributed to jupiter moon combination in lagna. So jupiter cannot be weak. Also his interests and knowledge in spirituality is again due to jupiter. Exalted mars may show his nature often but at the same time, these two planets are for sure not debilitated at all, in fact they are strong. His coninued interests in astrology and depth of knowledge in astrology and his love and respect for his guru are enough proof for these two planets' strength.

Dev

[ChandraLagna]

by surya » Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:50 am
I would like to offer up my details for discussion: pob - mumbai, tob-22:27, dob- oct 1 1962.
travelled to us in saturn MD (1980's), lots of struggle, but made a new career. Found stable job, got married had kids mid 1990's, bought property end of 1999. Career / life on upswing, until past 2.5yrs when things took a downturn till now.

Thank you sir, very nice of you.
7th and the 12th lord in the 3rd in debilitation aspecting the 9th house of long distance travel. Meets the dictum perfectly. 10th lord in the 9th aspecting the 12th lord, gives career abroad.

Down side is due to the setting in of Sadi sati and the antar Dasha of the Moon, being the 3rd in the 6th.Note shani's debilitation in the D9.

Thank you once again.

Thank you sir for sharing your data. Abji.....again, I beg to differ on the debilitation part


Mars is 1 deg in Cancer, in wonderful Punarvasu, owned by JUP and JUP is in Satabisha, owned by Rahu. JUP is 11L, so 12L and 7L is in 11L Nakshatra. Money etc abroad, as Rahu indicates foreign aspects!

Notice also MOON in rahu - again foreign indications!

No debilitation of Mars, sir. Foreign connection explained as you have done, plus additional angle of RAHU, too.

Warm regards,
Arun

[astroboy]

Sir ji, What is the strength of Guru ? Is he not debilitated in the Navamsha ? What is the Avasta of Kuja ? What is the point of Kuja being in Punarvasu ?

[ChandraLagna]

Sirji

Kumara, Shanta, khala.....for Jupiter.

Kumara is not bad at all. And Jup is retro too. !

Regards,
Arun

[map]

Surya ji,

The current situation will ease next yearmiddle but will recur 3 years later (2015) and will persist for a year. After 5 years from now you will rise again.

regards
map

[surya]

@astroboy ji, @arunsg321 ji, @dev ji: I am learning from your discussions. If you need further confirm info. w/regards to my chart pls. ask. My mom used to say "honi ko kaun tal sakta hai", I am a living example. Prayers will get me through, this too. Regards, and God Bless to all of you.


@map ji, hopefully Saturn in libra (nov.) will alleviate some. Eagerly looking forward to next year for some extended relief which is long overdue. At present prayers are my only hope. Thanks for responding. God Bless you.

[ashcan2004]

Arunji/ Astroboy : Thanks for good work !!

[Hina]

Very interesting discussion. If the whole rash was to be considered for debilitation or exaltation, why would the scriptures delineate the degrees? Can we call it deep debilitation vs. normal debilitation - for intensity of effects?

Thanks!

[surya]

Arunji/ Astroboy : Thanks for good work !!

Arunji, as you know, I am new to this science and trying to understand the analogy on how you approach the chart.

Lets begin from what you quoted

"Mars is 1 deg in Cancer, in wonderful Punarvasu, owned by JUP and JUP is in Satabisha, owned by Rahu. JUP is 11L, so 12L and 7L is in 11L Nakshatra. Money etc abroad, as Rahu indicates foreign aspects! "

Now lets focus on Venus and I will try to do same analogy:

Venus the Lord of 1+ 6 H placed in Visa which is ruled by Jupiter. Jupiter (Lord of 8 + 11 H) in turn placed in Satabisha ruled by Rahu

So I see co-relation between 1,6,8 & 11 H and have element of mystery with Rahu involved in it.

Venus is also aspected by neutral Mars ( L of 12 + 7) from 3rd H, friendly Sat (Lord of 9+10) from 9th H and Cojoins Mo, L of 3 H. Ju is also aspected by friendly mars from 3rd H.

Please correct me if I have stated anything wrong ?

Now the question, I would have with this information (if correct), how do we deduce INFORMATION out of it i.e. which matter could be affected how do we deduce results ?

My wild guess : 1 H + 6 H, could it mean some internal problems with health which is not easy to find considering Rahu factor and he had lot of good support from siblings to ward off the bad times, maybe some obstacles(8H) regarding health which is eventually overcome by some gains (11H)

or may Venus, Karaka for marriage is in 12th House from 7th in Rashi and again 12th House in D-9 could relate to some problems in marriage ?

@ashcan2004:
I have been very healthy "knock on wood" all my life, in fact preaching/practicing good habits to all. In regards to siblings, good moral support, but in other aspects I am the one pioneering/venturing into new fields encouraging siblings to follow. Gains have been steady before marriage, but booming after. Marriage good, with all the trials and tribulations that come with it. Thanks, for reviewing my chart. God Bless.
Regards,
S

[astroboy]

Good day Hina ji,

by Hina » Wed Aug 24, 2011 3:14 am
Very interesting discussion. If the whole rashi was to be considered for debilitation or exaltation, why would the scriptures delineate the degrees? Can we call it deep debilitation vs. normal debilitation - for intensity of effects?

It’s like this Hina ji. Your name is Mars. You have been dragged to a party under circumstances beyond your control.You are forced to attend it whether you like it or not. It’s a house party, the house is very big with 30 rooms in it. The host, who you despise and loath and makes you feel humiliated and wretched is in room 28,(deep debilitation point for Kuja) you enter the first room and already, you begin to feel the negative vibes. The weather is damp and cold, while you like a lot of heat. You like a spicy snack and all you get is some bland crap. The list goes on and on, nothing including the music is to your taste. The worst part is you are being dragged closer and closer to room 28 for reasons beyond your control. As you inch closer, your anger, frustration and disgust increases. As you reach room 28, you are at your worst and you feel tortured and victimized. The feeling remains even after you go through the torture of room 28 till you leave the building.

Yes, it is right to state, that the state of debilitation starts from the very first degree of a Rashi and ends only when the planet leaves that Rashi. The degree of frustration, humiliation and despise increases as it comes closer to the deep debilitation point. Just like combustion, debilitation is also to be treated on the same platform. Like combustion and deep combustion, debilitation should also be considered as debilitation and deep debilitation.

[digitsoftime]

Brilliant example Astroboy. What about planets placed in a house adjacent to the debilitation house but placed in a Nakshatra that shares 2 houses?

[astroboy]

lets see how many planets get debilitated in Rashi's that have the same Nakshatra extending to the next Rashi

Chandra gets debilitated in Scorpio - All nakshatra Padas end there

Ravi gets debilitated in Tula but the 4th Nakshatra Pada of Vishakha moves to Scorpio. But Ravi is a friend of Guru and more over the lord of the Rashi is his friend. Note the first 3Deg 20 Ravi remains in Mrithu avasta. But note Ravi's deep debilitation is at 10 Deg and there is 20 degrees to the end of the Rashi left.

Kuja gets debilitated in Cancer, But the Nakshatra Padas end in Cancer itself

Budha gets debilitated in Meena, all Nakshatra padas end in Meena

Shukra gets debilitated in Kanya. Kanya has two Padas of Chitra and the other two are in Tula. However For Shukra Tula is his Moola Trikona sign and own house. As the house lord, Shukra gets power over the Nakshatra lord.

Guru gets Debilitated in Makara. Danishta has the 3rd and the 4th Pada in Kumbha but Kuja the Nakshatra lord is a close friend of Guru. so the effect is not bad.

Shani gets debilitated in Mesha. Krittika has three padas in Vrishabha Rashi. But the lord is a great friend of Shani and shani is comfortable there. So comfortable, that he is a Yogakaraka for Taurus lagna. The final boss of the Nakshatras is the Rashi lord. please remember that.

Hope this clears your doubt Digits,

[digitsoftime]

Thanks Astroboy,

This Venus' placement in Kanya was what I actually had in mind since 2 padas of Chaitra are in Kanya covering the 27th degree, its deb point, and the remaining 2 padas in Libra, its MT. I guess the MT doesn't depends on the any specific point ans spread out through the rasi..?

regards,
S

[digitsoftime]

And Stewie is back!

[lovacrs]

I think the points of deep debilitation do not have their own independent existence. They are actually 180 deg from point of deep exaltation. Hence if you were to do a Nakhstra/pada analysis you should be doing it on exaltation points.

Secondly, astro classics ascribe results not just to points/sign of exaltation/debilitation but even to the fact whether the planets are in ascension (moving from debilitation to exaltation) or descending. One of the methods of calculation of longevity is based on distance in degrees from point of exaltation. Given this fact, I am inclined to go with the idea of sign of exaltation/debilitation and not the exact degrees.

Deepak ji - The birth details that I posted in "Abandoned Child" thread has Ma and Mo in exchange yoga.

[ashcan2004]

Arunji/ AB:

Dispositor of Planet is of great importance--------Should we consider Dispositor as the Rashi Lord or NK Lord ?

[Hina]

If the entire rashi was to be considered area of debilitation- the degrees or nakshata/ownership would stop mattering.

eg- Virgo has hasta & chita. Venus would be deb. in chitra- understood, but deb. in hasta - do not understand.

Thanks!

[astro123]

welcome back AB...that was a fantastic analogy and explanation of how Deb works...the same will hold true for exaltation points..Also other than rahu and ketu who takes precedence- Sign lord or Nk lord both in natal positions and in transits ?

[astroboy]

by Hina » Thu Aug 25, 2011 3:46 am
If the entire rashi was to be considered area of debilitation- the degrees or nakshata/ownership would stop mattering.
eg- Virgo has hasta & chita. Venus would be deb. in chitra- understood, but deb. in hasta - do not understand.

Hina ji, please go through my analogy again.

You are not getting the point. A planet gets debilitated not because he has a problem with the nakshatra lords per se. He has a problem with the owner and the environment of the Rashi. Deep debilitation points happen in nakshatras who are inimical or pure enemies to that planet.

For Example Ravi gets his deep debilitation at 10 deg in swati. Rahu is his bitter enemy, Kuja gets his deep debilitation in Ashlesha Nakshatra ruled by Budha. Guru gets his deep debilitation point in the Nakshatra of Ravi. Why ? Because a deva Guru like Jupiter always has a problem with the wild and egoistic ways of the King. remember, a king can also be cruel and act without logic at times. This trait is totally against what Guru stands for. So use logic and you will find that there is a explaination for everything.

Trust this helps,

[krishnagopal1968]

Dear all,

Entire rasi has to be taken for debilitation is my view too.

However apart from debilitation theories, the main combination for wealth in this jabalpur born chart, is due to 5th and 11th axis and powerful 2nd house. Strange that nobody discusses about this